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Getting On : Catching up
Time to celebrate da 1st anniversary!! | from pharmaboy - Wednesday, September 11, 2002
accessed 1669 times 11/9 attacks on dear democratic, christian america. Although I'm not pro-islam, I still think it's time to celebrate(i.e. get wasted...) Ok, so our dear grandpa was a lunatic, that we can all agree on, but the one & only thing I learned as a child & haven't thrown away(yet) was a repulsion for the US goverment and its false patriotism. Even that so called free, perfect system of goverment called democracy, you have an illusion of freedom, but you're more enslaved than ever because you don't even realize it. Not that totalitarian is any better, but utimately, how much does your token of choice(voting every 5 yerars) really count? What about free speech? Sure you can complain to your local newspaper if the garbagemen are rude, try denouncing some real issues & see where you get.
A good book on this subject is a compliation of writings put together by Russ Kick called "everything you know is wrong". The family was fucked up, but at least now that I left, I still don't swallow it all as long as it comes from da TV. Just think, when, except for the war of independence, did the states EVER fight a legitimate war? By legitimate I intend either to defend what's yours from intruders or to defend your house & family. Not going halfway across the globe to fight people who really couldn't care less about you, or scrificing your own innocent people(pearl harbour, twin towers) to stir the general public's patriotic sentiment & create a new evil. Americans are nice people, I have nothing against americans, but they're so naive it's pathetic! What did your grandfather go to die for in WW2, patriotism, democracy? or the spanish american war? or vietnam? The gulf war? Yugoslavia? I personally admire the way Milosevic is making a joke of that "international war crimes tribunal", they are a joke! They invented the crime of "aggressive warfare" to condemn german officers in WW2, well, who's the most guilty of aggresive warfare?
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Reader's comments on this article Add a new comment on this article |  from pharmaboy
Monday, September 16, 2002 - 05:20
(Agree/Disagree?)
I'm not going to start a flame war when this could be an interesting debate, this reply isn't a personal attack on anyone in particular.
1) First of all, I am not South African, I just live here since a few months. Before I came here from Europe, The only thing I knew about SA was the great Mandela & the evil Apartheid. You talk about atrocities? What the fuck do you really know about South Africa? Things are never only good & evil in the real world, only on TV & reading fairy tales will you find the evil guy & the Saint. The apartheid was not completely right because I believe we all should be given the opportunity to prove ourselves, but it was not nearly as bad as it is portrayed in history books. Up until ten years ago, South Africa was more stable economically than many European countries, it sold arms to the states, & had a strong industry. You could leave your car unlocked & go shopping because crime was almost non-existent. Now the Rand has lost 40% off it’s value against the dollar, I good friend of mine was raped last Thursday morning on her way to work, Johannesburg is known as the crime capital of the world. I am not hinting at any racist ideas, but I saw with my own eyes & from speaking to people here that everything I was convinced I knew about SA from learning it in history class or TV was a twisted one-sided viewpoint: what I thought I knew was all wrong.
2) Who gives a shit about whether you vote every 5 or 4 years? I am ridiculing the whole form of government that we call “democracy”, LOL! I have researched many different forms of government/political viewpoints (National Socialism, Monarchy, Communism, Anarchism, & our well known pseudo-democracy), I haven’t found any that I can completely agree with, nor do I believe that a perfect form of government even exists. During communist times in Russia, or the Tianmen(sp?) square incident in China, at least it was obvious to many of the people living there that they were not free, so there was & is a strong underground subversive movement and/or sentiment among most of the general population of these countries. As I already said in my post democracy puts us to sleep, it sedates our mind with a relatively easy life & yes, you can enjoy sex with animals or getting lots of cock up your ass, & you can be open about it without fear of repression from your government, but your sexual preferences aren’t a threat to them. Ok, you like to get tied up & get your balls twisted, that’s your problem, just don’t go advertising it in some fucking gay pride march. If someone(not a rockstar) openly admits to the use of LSD, he become a social outcast, simply because school/tv tells you acid is dangerous, evil, even if the number of deaths caused by acid compared to the number of people that have used it is WAY lower than that of a common OTC drug, Tylenol. It is illogical to think that Hitler was the cause of WW2, & it’s stupid to believe that he was any less guilty than the other parties involved in that horrible war where the innocent, dumb citizens of countries all around the world paid the price, regardless of which side. In SA I have met war veterans of the SA/Angola war, the stories they told were shocking. That war was fought because of the cold war, and which countries were responsible for the cold war, duh? Who was dying on the battlefield, 17 year old kids, SA had nothing against Angola but they wanted to keep the US as a good arms customer! So much for your fucking democracy & freedom.
3) I don’t have any answers, I never try to push my brand of religion or ideas on anyone, but I try hard to ask myself the right questions & never accept anything just because Berg said it, my pastor said it, or because my government/tv said it. By reading some of the replies, it seems that most of the stuff you think you know is from what you learned in your history class in school or from CNN, & just because berg/family are crazy, that means that naturally, the TV is right, because you could never watch Tv as a child, you now so proud to be finally “free” to watch tv…& believe all it spoon-feeds you. Wake up!! Just because they were crazy doesn’t automatically make everything non-family right, just because communist Russia had a repressive, tyrannical form of government, doesn’t make it’s nemesis, US, any more just & right than they were. Don’t try to be dumb, exercise your mind, look at everything with a non-prejudiced mind, but decide for yourself, after analysing real proof(no, I don’t mean that 3hr. documentary on Bin Laden, approved by Bush) come to a rational conclusion.
4) I made sure on the 11th that I said “happy 11/9” to as many people I came across, just to shock them. I posted this hoping that ex-fam guys would be a bit more open-minded than others, but except for a few, I think you are as duped & stupid as the rest of the large crowd? Why the hell did you even leave the family? Because you couldn’t get drunk? Listen to “evil” system music? Watch TV? If yes, then you’ve learned nothing, you might as well have been in a coma the whole time you spent there. I also disliked all the rules, but I always managed to get around them. I got drunk more when I was 15 in the family than I ever have, alot of my present CD collection I bought while in the fam. I thing that made me really sick of it all, was that using your own head in the Family was heavily discouraged, & your viewpoints & beliefs were handed to you from some lunatic & you dared not question them. Now I hardly watch TV & when I read the daily paper, I get so angry at the lies & the way bad guy vs. good guy is written in such a melodramatic way, trying to make me hate today’s bad guy. You should read 1984 by Orwell, it’s scary to note the similarities with his fictional world & our own. I have learned just to shut up & stay on my own, because everyone I have met so far are shocked or repulsed by my views, or they think I need help. But why should I choose not to use my head?
5) Almost 3,000 people died on 9/11, does that give the US the right to kill say 3,000 people, many innocent, on another side of the globe? With little real proof( A doctored videotape) linking Bin Laden to the attacks? How many people have died since the US sanctions on Iraq, Saddam hasn’t died, children & civilians have, but you don’t have a day to remember those victims The US was warned by secret services from different countries that a terrorist attack was imminent, and they got some near perfect films of it taking place. The US can now do anything in the name of the war on terrorism, none but a few make weak protests for fear of being labelled a terrorist. This sounds kinda like pearl Harbour, doesn’t it? This “war on terror” bullshit is like the war on drugs, it’s a symptom of a another problem, & they will never win against terrorism unless they kill every single Palestinian, Afghani & Iraqi. Neither will they ever win the war on drugs, unless they destroy every human being on this planet. The stories you hear of evil dealers giving junior high kids heroin is just media frenzy. You’re much more likely to find junior high kids coming to you & asking you for it. There is availability because of demand, that’s a simple law of economy. Meth is an evil, addictive drug except when used by the USAF to keep their pilots awake for days, that’s not something they tell you. A terrorist or suicide bomber is not someone who wakes up one morning, bumps his & decides that Bush is the devil. A “terrorist” is someone who has little to lose, & sees his own inability to do anything to improve the conditions of his family. After years of desperation and suffering, turning to a type of “cult”, is the only way out to them. Have any of you (me included) ever lived in conditions half as bad as Palestinians are living now? I would think us in the pampered west haven’t, so how the fuck can you judge them? I tell myself everyday that I know nothing, at least that way I won’t ever stop learning. Berg was an idiot, but Bush isn’t a very bright lad either.
And one last thing, I celebrated on this weekend the 11/9, I’ve been awake since Friday. I’m at work now, and the music is still playing in my head! Peace & fuck everything you believe in to y'all.
Cheers,
Someone that should get locked up
(reply to this comment)
|  From Monet
Wednesday, October 09, 2002, 11:19
(Agree/Disagree?)
Pharmaboy,
You make some good points considering how strongly you feel about your hatred for America.
Let me point out to you some truth within your truth. Even if your 100% correct about the U.S Government and all their tactics to control our minds (TV, News, music...etc) There not alone. In every human being there is an instinct to control, whether it be as small as controlling your waste system to as big as controlling the world.
Politics is all about control. Each person who''s the head of each country is in control of their people. Democracies have the least forceful control over their people compared to communism at least as far as I have seen. Correct me if I''m wrong on that.
Yes, the US may have other forms of control that the citizen are not aware of, like showing us only what they want to show us about the truth in other countries. However, so does every other country. I don''t know what they tell you in South America what America is like, but do you think that is really what A.M.E.R.I.C.A is like? Everybody has there own truth. And what one person''s truth is dosn''t make it everyones truth. The media''s truth no matter what country doesn''t make it everyone''s truth.
So, the question that I have for you now that I came to the conclusion that every country uses some sort of control over their people, why do you hate the U.S governments form of control, and your not even living here? (reply to this comment) |
| | From pharmaboy
Thursday, October 10, 2002, 02:37
(Agree/Disagree?)
Monet, umm, just because I disagree 100% with the American governments foreign policy, doesn’t mean I have anything against ordinary American citizens (well, many are obese, LOL). I never said anything against the so-called American way of life, hell, I love big city life and it's vices.
Did I mention anywhere that American people are bad, in most cases the US government goes to war & does what it feels like, then with they convince the general public that it was the "right" thing to do. Example, while I hate the family as an institution, I don't hate(most) of it's members, they're just poor, misguided individuals.
I live in Johannesburg, not South America. I have lived most my life in Europe/EE/Russia, Communism is a dead-end, but that doesn't automatically make democracy good and free.
Yes, it is everyone's instinct to control, but fucking hell, you're dealing with the lives of millions of innocent people, & that’s unacceptable!!
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| | From Monet
Thursday, October 10, 2002, 12:20
(Agree/Disagree?)
I'm not suggesting you have anything against ordinary American citizens. I thought I was on the same page as
you... speaking of the government. Neither am I saying that democracy is all good and all free.
What I am saying is that all forms of governments have some sort of control over their people. You said, "Yes, it is everyone's instinct to control, but fucking hell, you're dealing with the lives of millions of innocent people, & that’s unacceptable!!"
Everyone is out for their own survival, and they will do what ever it takes for them to survive. whether they're dealing with the lives of millions of innocent people or not.
If America feels threatened, they will do what it takes to survive. If Johannesburg feels threatened, they will do what it takes to survive. If Iraq feels threatened they will do what it takes to survive. And only the strong survive.
War is not acceptable, millions of innocent people die. But that's part of our reality.(reply to this comment) |
| | From pharmaboy sighs....
Friday, October 11, 2002, 02:50
(Agree/Disagree?)
How come the states always feels threatened by obscure countries around the world? Why doesn't France or Italy go around doing the same? Maybe with Afghanistan and now Iraq they feel threatened, but what about the countless other wars they've fought and "helping hand" they've given by financing "their" side? If you read my post I wasn't against war, if it's for a legitimate reason(i.e. self-defence)
The US is paranoid, I would say way too much Crystal, but the amphetamine psychosis is already critical. I once believed after 90 hours of no sleep that my housemate was poisoning my food. I threw away the entire contents of the fridge, but at least I didn't go bombing his whole country of origin!!!
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| | | | | From Monet
Thursday, October 10, 2002, 12:30
(Agree/Disagree?)
Joe, I think you and I got off on the wrong foot. If I remember correctly the first time we "reasoned" you mis quoted me and than continued by attacking me on that quote that I never said.
It's in my nature to attack when I feel like I'm being attacked. Since than, I've read some of your posts and comments and came to the conclusion that you most of had a bad day that day. Because, I haven't seen you mis quote anyone else.
Peace(reply to this comment) |
| | | | | From Bella
Monday, September 16, 2002, 17:11
(Agree/Disagree?)
Pharmaboy –
While you have some interesting points, my problem with your post(s) is that you seem to have this view (you call it repulsion) of America that mimics what we have been fed our whole lives from Berg. Perhaps referring to you as a type of Berg supporter was a bit harsh, for that I apologize. I have a sincere proposition for you - I have been out of the COG for many years now, so perhaps you can refresh my memory as to one of Berg’s political ideologies that is worth hanging on to. Please don’t tell me that Americans should just pray for God to kill Sadaam Hussein, as the COG prayed He would “Kill Komenie” – I need something a little more realistic than that.
I agree with you 100% that one must continually question the information one is fed via the news (TV or paper), teachers, books, peers, discussion groups, etc etc. Although, I do not believe that Berg ever taught any of us that valuable lesson. How many times were you told to “accept it by faith” and “Revolutionaries don’t ask questions!” - Two quotes I hate the most from my childhood. Perhaps this is why you feel so strongly about questioning everything now; I know it is why I do. There is an assumption in your posts (and other’s) that Americans are either stupid or naïve by default. Although there are many Americans who fit your profile, is not the case that all Americans are like that. Furthermore, just because one is patriotic, does not mean they are naïve. I have MANY problems with my government, as do most Americans. For you to have such disregard for the loss of life on 9/11 is a slap in the face of the Americans on this board, and all nationalities who also lost fellow citizens.
So dear pharmaboy I ask you, have you sincerely questioned the political views that you were raised with? Do your current opinions stem from your childhood? Or, having left the COG and researching the subject for yourself, do you feel this way independently of Berg’s brainwashing?
Anticipating your reply,
Bella
(reply to this comment) |
| | From pharmaboy
Monday, September 16, 2002, 23:23
(Agree/Disagree?)
I have questioned everything I was taught growing up, that's why I easily scare the general public when I am honest about my views, when I say everything, I mean EVERYTHING! Although I'm 19, since 15 I've seriously been though many ideologies/reglions: Nazism, Witchcraft/nature worship, buddism, socialism, anarchy. I started from zero, even questioning if it is wrong to kill another human. The only belief I'm sure of is: your liberty ends when it interferes with another's liberty of choice(i.e. his life). That is all, everything else I've thrown to the wind.
I don't like to be this way, ignorance is bliss, whether in the family or out. I can't ever find peace of mind. Every day I wake up and ask myself what my reason is for waking up, I ask the seemingly normal, happy people what their reason is for exsisting, they usually don't know(never asked themself that question) or it's something absurd like: "well, for my family of course!".
Someone once said we need someone weaker dependent on us to give our life meaning, does it work that way with god to?
I wish I could watch tv and just accept everything, but I can't. I pretend every day to those around me that I'm a normal mid-class 9 to 5 person, but I can't convince myself.(reply to this comment) |
| | from Bella
Sunday, September 15, 2002 - 20:22
(Agree/Disagree?)
Wow Pharmaboy - Do you also believe that America [is] the Whore!?
I'm not even going to begin to pick apart your pathetic little posting - your details are far too inaccurate and quite frankly I wouldn't know where to begin.
How about you learn a little more about our form of Government (which we do not claim is perfect), and then post something on this board that is worth the read.
I'll give you a little clue as to where you can begin:
Question: How often do the citizens of the United States of America vote for a new President?
Hint: not every 5 years.
Berg's political views were idiotic and you are just as big an idiot for continuing to support them.
(reply to this comment)
| From Auty
Monday, September 16, 2002, 15:33
(Agree/Disagree?)
Perhaps one of the point's bella is trying to emphasize is that there could be a slight possibility that your thinking is largely based on your up-bringing? I have to admit that when I first came back to the States I hated all American's & anything they would do I would criticize (I am an American myself). It's funny, after living here for 10 years it's not as bad as Berg stated. I'm living with all the American systemites & loving most every minute of it.
Also, the fact that you got the voting system wrong kind of tells me that either that was a typo or your statements on the American government are not accurate as you haven't put that much study into the political system. PolySc 101 baby.
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| | | | | From JohnnieWalker
Monday, September 16, 2002, 07:08
(Agree/Disagree?)
If you don't think Pharmaboy's post is worth reading then you might at least find the book he mentioned (Everything You Know is Wrong - ISBN 0971394202) worth reading. It might make you think twice about the things you believe you know about the US government, flawed or not.
Two other good books (so I'm told) are 1) the prequel to the aforementioned book, "You are Being Lied To" (ISBN 0966410076) and 2) Travels With Dr. Death and Other Unusual Investigations (No ISBN available).
I am German and in no postion to comment on US politics, government or military. But in Germany alone, there is a heck of a lot more going on "behind the scenes" than the public is informed of (and this is becoming slightly more obvious with the current election campaigns) -- so much so that I wouldn't doubt, although not gullibly accept, that many of the things Berg had to say about my country were true. Just because he was a pervert doesn't make everything he said bad nor every opinion he held a wrong one.
His political views as published in the Letters were his own opinions, many of which were based on gut feeling (aka "hearing from the Lord about it") or an obvious bias. His mistake was allowing them to be published under the guise of "the Word of God". This doesn't mean, however, that he didn't hit the nail on the head (or at least got close) with some of his views.
Whether his being right was a fluke or he knew what he was talking about is another matter altogether. But my reason for commenting on what you wrote is to say that you cannot generalize and ask whether Pharmaboy believes that "America is the Whore" or say that he "supports" Berg simply because he states that he agrees with some of his political views.(reply to this comment) |
| | From --
Tuesday, October 08, 2002, 17:38
(Agree/Disagree?)
Ok I'm trying really hard not to confuse bergs pervertedness with his political views (sarcasm). My memory is fading fast so correct me if I'm wrong. Berg hated the jews, hated america, and said black people are cursed. That sounds like racism to me. and racism is political. And for that reason in my opinion all his political teachings are insane. There all biased and skewed towards his demented mind.(reply to this comment) |
| | From Deranged1
Sunday, September 15, 2002, 22:15
(Agree/Disagree?)
Why must everyone who rips on America be accused of supporting Berg's political views on the issue? It most likely has nothing to do with that. Plenty of people hate the US for very good reason. I know a struggling Iraqi businessman who at one point was trying hard to make a living to support his family living in squalor back home due to US sanctions which put them completely out of business there. I guess the US thought they'd do him a favor and take a load off him, because later they managed to kill half of them. Would you try to stay completely open-minded and unbiased in view of a country that did that to your family? I, like Joe, also appreciate Pharmaboy's boldness, while I also think he's a little extreme for me. And look, you're not the first person who's ripped on Pharmaboy not being worth comment here because he's in South Africa. I don't get it. South Africa isn't too far from places that have been affected negatively to the extreme by the US. Pharmaboy doesn't have to fucking learn all your government's time spans for holding office, or any other irrelevant rules, just to make a sensational point like the one here.
Question: Are you aware that South Africa has the SAME form of government as your own?(reply to this comment) |
| | from JoeH
Sunday, September 15, 2002 - 18:26
(Agree/Disagree?)
dear drug user, south africans are hardly in a position to criticize the US government, as screwed up as it may be. I don't need to mention the atrocities y'all have committed in your times
(reply to this comment)
| from Free_Dom_Fighter
Friday, September 13, 2002 - 23:12
(Agree/Disagree?)
I am American/Serbian. I'm not living in either country right now, but I do have family I care about very much in both. I've always felt a true patriot for both of my countries. I've got 2 flags over my bed. Yes it's true, Serbia has killed hundreds of innocent children. And yes, America did pulverize the maternity ward where my sister was born (don't worry Nique, I don't hold it against any of you brave Air Force pilots, after all it's not your fault if another one of those God damn errant laser-targeted smart bombs takes its own course).
My take on the whole issue: The world is a fucked up place, so try to avoid taking things too seriously people and maybe you'll live longer.
(reply to this comment)
| | | | from monkeyfart
Friday, September 13, 2002 - 21:48
(Agree/Disagree?)
I have to agree at least in part with your opinions though it seems your going to have some problems with some of these over-patriotic contributers with their totalistic viewpoints. Problem with a lot of them is they really think that 1 american life is worth about 100 of those of other nationalities, so their take on the world and sense of patriotism gets warped.
(reply to this comment)
| | | | | | | from Nique
Friday, September 13, 2002 - 20:39
(Agree/Disagree?)
What a horrible thing to say...People of all ages, cultures, and belief systems died that day. I could have replied to your article with insults and the same thoughtlessness you so clearly demonstrated but I decided to check out your profile first and realized you're not worth it. You obviously do not have a clear understanding of what happened and what the attack was about. Regardless of what the attack was about, there was no justification for merciless suffering the terrorists inflicted on so many that day. I noticed from your profile that you are not living in the country I've been proudly serving for the last 8 and-a-half years as an Air Force member which means you are not (directly, at least) partaking in the freedoms or benefits that I fight to protect so there is no point in getting angry with you. You may change your mind one day and regret the hateful things you said, I hope so, until then, I'll continue to serve my country and hope for your safety too.
(reply to this comment)
| | | | From lucidchick
Friday, September 13, 2002, 21:18
(Agree/Disagree?)
Thanks, Nique, for what you to to defend our country and my freedoms. Seems like for some people it's reprehensible to have stereotypes about everybody except the USA and its people. I am very grateful that now I have an EARTHLY country. The feelings were especially poignant Wednesday. I won't pretend that for me personally it didn't take a lot of time and education (with a curriculum heavy on subjects directly relating to our civics and the development of certain American institutions) to stop feeling disenfranchised and start to belong. But considering where I was coming from, it was totally understandable. The fact is, I had been disenfrachised for almost two decades. I suffered from culture shock for years, and I try to remind myself of that when I hear stuff on this site about the USA that irritate me. Another point is that there is a huge variety within our country that people forget exists (Joe H, after graduating you might have a chance to check out one of our fantastic cities, sure to satisfy even the most demanding of cosmopolitans. If you want I'll give you a tour of mine. Glad you didn't misunderstand my comment about your confidence -- and I'm proud to be on your cool list). I'll even cop to having a fridge magnet I got in san Francisco, that warns: "Careful or we shall banish you to the Midwest!"(reply to this comment) |
| | From JoeH
Friday, September 13, 2002, 23:15
(Agree/Disagree?)
good one! I went through the midwest on a couple Family road trips and that definitely rings true. I'm not a small town boy though, as you suggested with such brilliant subtlety. I actually live in Portland, Oregon which is popularly known as the lesbian capital of the US (possibly even the world). Unfortunately it's the biggest US city I've lived in since the Family (only about 2 million people).
While I appreciate Pharmaboy's boldness, he's a little extreme for me. I understand though, it's a phase we all go through. However, I think both sides of this debate need to open up a bit. America has some good ideals and people, and for the most part it's a decent place to live. Not a utopia of enlightment, but no other country on earth is, so everybody should just watch their mouths until they can say otherwise. That being said, we've been a bit of a bully in the international scene since we got off our feet about 200 years ago and other countries are bound to bear us some resentment. While I like Jews and I support Israel's right to exist, I don't approve of the US's unilateral backing of Israel. Everybody over there has done some messed up shit, and only through forgiveness and open-mindedness can we hope for a solution.
To conclude, question everything!!(reply to this comment) |
| | From Nique
Saturday, September 14, 2002, 11:37
(Agree/Disagree?)
My main main problem was with his opening statement. If pharmaboy was saying that it was time to celebrate the good that came out of the attacks and the way people were brought together then I wouldn't have had a problem with it. I don't think that's what he was saying though. September 11th was not a time to celebrate, but a time to reflect and remember those people who lost their lives. It was not American politics that suffered that day, but people. I believe that everyone has a right to their opinion about america's politics and I understand that many see us as a bully. I am not naive and do not blindly accept everything my government does as right, but like Joe said, (reply to this comment) |
| | From Nique
Saturday, September 14, 2002, 11:39
(Agree/Disagree?)
cont..."no other country on earth" can lay claim to being a eutopia of enlightenment. I also don't see that much evidence in pharmaboy's post of a well-informed opinion. If his profile is correct, he's 19 and would not have been out of the cult that long thus may still be spouting remnants of old indoctrination, also, if living in South Africa, he may not yet have even visited here or had a chance to learn what America and its people are about. There are many things I don't approve of in America's politics, however, no matter what my feelings are about any government, if they were attacked as we were, I would not encourage others to celebrate the event. I am open to questions and debate though on politics or any other subject.(reply to this comment) |
| | From pharmaboy
Tuesday, October 08, 2002, 09:30
(Agree/Disagree?)
You dumb fuck! You sound like my uncle(USAF Captain), patriotism is the tool governments use to sway the masses. Just like they used prophecy to make us feel guilty in the family. Mind you, I have nothing wrong with individual americans, but would have gone on a month crank binge if that plane would have hit bush!!!!!
I got over that patriotism crap a while ago, it would be healthy for you to get rid of it too!(reply to this comment) |
| | From Craven de Kere
Tuesday, October 08, 2002, 09:58
(Agree/Disagree?)
"Patriotism is the last refuge of the scoundrel" - I forgot the author.
'Beware the leader who bangs the drums of war in order to whip the citizenry into a patriotic fervor, for patriotism is indeed a double-edged sword. It both emboldens the blood, just as it narrows the mind…And when the drums of war have reached a fever pitch and the blood boils with hate and the mind has closed, the leader will have no need in seizing the rights of the citizenry. Rather, the citizenry, infused with fear and blinded with patriotism, will offer up all of their rights unto the leader, and gladly so. How do I know? For this is what I have done.And I am Caesar.' - Anon (from a net hoax)
I HATE jingoism.
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| | | | | From Craven loves Shakey
Wednesday, October 09, 2002, 00:45
(Agree/Disagree?)
No I don''t read snopes. But I read that play (it was supposed to be from Shakey''s play not a quote from Caesar).
In any case what reminded me of the hoax was when Barbara Striesand recently fell for it while campaigning against the war in Iraq. She went on and on about how amazing it was to have been written so long ago and made a fool out of herself.
It was Matt Drudge who got credit for catching her on the error and it''s at this moment that I curse the fact that I don''t own the most popular news weblog on earth and he does.(reply to this comment) |
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | From JoeH
Sunday, September 15, 2002, 18:24
(Agree/Disagree?)
It makes a lot of sense, and the fact is that Saddam is just stupid, defying the US and the rest of the world like he's doing. You can criticize the US all you want, and let's face it, they've got their faults, but Saddam's going to bring the war on his head. Let's just hope a minimal amount of Iraqui civilians get killed as a result of their jackass leader. (reply to this comment) |
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Thursday, October 10, 2002, 07:39
(Agree/Disagree?)
"Pharmaboy" I think I may have lived with you for a brief period...
I cannot believe you haven't grown out of all that left wing extremism crap, didn't you find something else during puperty to amuse yourself with.
BTW what might help is actually deciding where your from and forming some rational views on that political system leaving the foreign policy to the ever so moderate belgians.
Sounds good no?(reply to this comment) |
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