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Getting Through : Dealing

a schematised view of leaving ( before/during/after )

from alicespiteandmalice - Sunday, April 24, 2005
accessed 1380 times

An attempt at schematising the before and after of cult life ( for SGA's ).

I drew this schema while I was working ( behind my bar ), and although it was initially meant to be an attempt at a new form of poetry, I thought it might be interesting to put it up here and see what other ex-SGA's think about it. It’s based partly on my experience, partly on my observation of others and what I’ve read on this site.
The stages that are in bold can be permanent ( example: one can be in Denial one’s whole life ), whereas the others are temporary.

I, for one, am somewhere between Distress and Denial ( for now ).

Thanks for the feedback,


( I hesitated on whether to put this in Creative Writing or Dealing, and opted for the latter because I believe that was my ulterior motive in writing it. )

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from analysis of variance
Tuesday, April 26, 2005 - 13:22

Poetry? In my line of work, we call this a structural equation model. We devise scales to correspond to each construct (level of ignorance might be viewed as the dependent variable and measured by the Irrational Values Scale, a 9-item likert). After careful measurement of independent variables corresponding to other the constructs (absence of doubt might be captured by a proxy like the 7-item Self-Righteousness Scale), we load results into an SEM procedure using software like SPSS and generate co-efficients for the lines. Significant co-efficients between moderating variables illustrate interaction effects, so that we can predict how much ignorance is explained by the interaction between deconstruction, escapism, denial and doubt.
(reply to this comment)
From alicespiteandmalice
Tuesday, April 26, 2005, 20:39


wow, I must admit that before your post I am reminded of my ignorance ( not in the above sense of the word )...
I'm afraid I don't quite understand alot of what your saying, but you seem to be alot more knowledgeable than I in this domain.

Why poetry? Simply because that is what I had in mind as I was writing it. If you're interested, I scanned the original ( handwritten à main levée on a scrap of Camel paper ), proof that this is far from having come out of a machine.

thanks for your post,

(reply to this comment
from Christian
Monday, April 25, 2005 - 22:05

Average visitor agreement is 1 out of 5(Agree/Disagree?)
Ok guys really you already left do you have to muse over these things really get over it.
(reply to this comment)
From alicespiteandmalice
Tuesday, April 26, 2005, 07:52

Average visitor agreement is 5 out of 5Average visitor agreement is 5 out of 5Average visitor agreement is 5 out of 5Average visitor agreement is 5 out of 5Average visitor agreement is 5 out of 5(Agree/Disagree?)

For someone into poetry, your comment seems somewhat misplaced.

That aside, trying to understand/define/portray/schematise the progress from one state to another within a defined system is what alot of psychologists ( not to mention economists, geographists,sociologists, etc and soforth ) do, and I doubt you'd tell them to "move on".

(reply to this comment
from xolox
Monday, April 25, 2005 - 21:00


I think the arrow from doubt to distress should be a two way.

Good job!
(reply to this comment)

From alicespiteandmalice
Monday, April 25, 2005, 21:42


I didn't make it a two way arrow because i think that one one has doubted and has been in distress, going back on his doubt would be denial, whereas doubt would be where one first questions his beliefs, which up till that point where word of truth.

Thanks for your comment,

alice(reply to this comment
From xolox
Tuesday, April 26, 2005, 08:22

I suppose I meant doubt in it's broader sence. Self doubt has little to do with denial, where as to regress to doubting ones belief system after having moved past it, could indeed fall under that category. (reply to this comment
From alicespiteandmalice
Tuesday, April 26, 2005, 12:45

"to regress to doubting ones belief system after having moved past it"

yeah, this is what I meant. I agree with you that it is important to keep questioning ones self ( "self doubt" ), but the Doubt stage in the diagram understated "doubt of ones beliefs", in this case the Family beliefs.

thanks for your posts,

(reply to this comment
from Phoenixkidd
Monday, April 25, 2005 - 19:24

Average visitor agreement is 5 out of 5Average visitor agreement is 5 out of 5Average visitor agreement is 5 out of 5Average visitor agreement is 5 out of 5Average visitor agreement is 5 out of 5(Agree/Disagree?)

That is so true! Your Diagram almost fits things to a T. I believe a lot of people, myself included, go through Doubt and then complete Denial for a long period following the seperation from the cult. However, especially those of us who spent 20+ years in the cult and especially those of the older SGA's have had so much of our thinking and values molded by the cults way, it turns out to be very difficult for us to discount our entire lives in the cult as though it never happened. I sincerely believe only through recognition we can truly recover from our past. After all there are many cases of neglected and abused children in many sectors of society or throughout turmoil in war. Those children have to face up to the fact that their lives are not normal their resources, are severly lacking in education and background and must just move on. Having Ricky's memorial broadcasted on any kind of media brings to light these issues of ex-cult members that so many people are so unfamiliar with.
(reply to this comment)

from alicespiteandmalice
Sunday, April 24, 2005 - 12:29

oops, somehow the image isn't on...
(reply to this comment)
From alicespiteandmalice
Sunday, April 24, 2005, 12:35

there you go(reply to this comment

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