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Getting On : Literature Reviews
Do you have a healthy mind? | from Joe H - Tuesday, December 07, 2004
accessed 1561 times In the chatroom, banal_commentator implied that there was someting wrong with being "all cynical and jaded and perverted like cult kids." I couldn't disagree more. I was reminded of a paragraph from The Notebooks of Don Rigoberto by Mario Vargas Llosa, so I decided to translate it and share it with all of you. "I know no lie more abject than the expression taught to children 'Healthy mind in healthy body'. Who ever said a healthy mind was a desirable goal? 'Healthy', in this case, means stupid, conventional, lacking imagination and malice, domesticated by the stereotypes of established morals and official religion. Is that a 'healthy' mind? No! It's a conformist mind, the mind of a monk, of a notary, an insurance agent, an altar boy, a virgin, a boyscout. That's not health, that's a defect. A rich and personal mental life requires curiosity, malice, fantasies and unsatisfied desires, in other words, a 'dirty' mind -- evil thoughts, flowering of forbidden images, appetites that lead to the exploration of the unknown and the renovation of the known, and systematic challenges to inherited ideas, hackneyed knowledge, and accepted values."
Original text: "No conozco mentira más abyecta que la expresión con que se alecciona a los niños: «Mente sana en cuerpo sano». ¿Quién ha dicho que una mente sana es un ideal deseable? «Sana» quiere decir, en este caso, tonta, convencional, sin imaginación y sin malicia, adocenada por los estereotipos de la moral establecida y la religión oficial. ¿Mente «sana», eso? Mente conformista, de beata, de notario, de asegurador, de monaguillo, de virgen y de boyscout. Eso no es salud, es tara. Una vida mental rica y propia exige curiosidad, malicia, fantasía y deseos insatisfechos, es decir, una mente «sucia», malos pensamientos, floración de imágenes prohibidas, apetitos que induzcan a explorar lo desconocido y a renovar lo conocido, desacatos sistemáticos a las ideas heredadas, los conocimientos manoseados y los valores en boga."
Full article: http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/Cafe/3627/rigoberto.htm#DIATRIBA%20CONTRA%20EL%20DEPORTISTA |
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Reader's comments on this article Add a new comment on this article |  from SeanSwede
Sunday, August 05, 2007 - 11:23
(Agree/Disagree?)
I couldn`t agree more with you JoeH. Totally my kinda stuff.
(reply to this comment)
| | | |  From SeanSwede
Monday, August 06, 2007, 04:33
(Agree/Disagree?)
Mental health care advisers work at psychiatric departments/facilities. We also yield support
At the patients own home environment. A big part of my work involves helping patients to discover and develop their own capabilities within their everyday life. We do that by having a dialog with them and going thru daily work therapy. For example by training and/or assisting the patient with various day to day duties or so called ADL (all day life) at home or at their living quarters at a rehab facility. I support patients with their social interactions with other people, for example supporting them in daring to come out and engage in social activities such as going shopping or visiting an activity center or to attend a school.
We work often in teams of colleges consisting of nurses, therapists, undernurses and psychologists. I have medical duties such as administering neuroleptica (anti-psychosis drugs/medication) to patients. Taking blood and urine tests. Administering medicin injections I work part time at a major hospital here in Stockholm at a kriminal psychiatric treatment department. The patients there are under strict supervision seeing that they are considerd a serious threat to themselves and to society. They are diagnosed with various serious forms of psychiatric disorders or are under extensive treatment and observation awaiting the diagnosis outcome.(reply to this comment) |
| | From thatata
Monday, August 06, 2007, 08:14
(Agree/Disagree?)
Some people here work at cool jobs,yours is one of them.But mabye the question I wanted to ask more was do you belive in any special theory of psychology?Ive read Civilization and Its Discontents its a small enough book to read,and Ive tried reading things about Jung,but would skip around.And I think we all have a pop understanding or knowledge of the "Oedipus Complex" and what not.But what do you think about all that junk.
Is freud an idiot or a genius?Or is he just some kind of artist who wanted to have sex with his mom?
(reply to this comment) |
| | from banal_commentator
Friday, December 10, 2004 - 07:51
(Agree/Disagree?)
Joe,
You misunderstood me in the chat, and you misunderstand me still. I tried to explain what I meant to you, but you did not listen and instead posted a whole article about it--sunny style. I am now forced to repeat myself: I did use those words to describe a sinner/saint contrast. I implied that being cynical and jaded MAY be subordinate to having child like innocence and hope as oppossed to having a "jaded," bored and "so banal" world view. For what else can replace the thrill of novelty? Wisdom, perhaps; but unfortunately wisdom earned through experience is often substituted or accompanied with caustic knowledge and an underlying sense of bitterness, anger and the expectation of failure and dissapointment.
(reply to this comment)
| | | | | | | from whatever1037
Thursday, December 09, 2004 - 16:31
 (Agree/Disagree?)
Arent you or whoever wrote that think for everyone else ?
(reply to this comment)
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | from lisa
Thursday, December 09, 2004 - 09:29
(Agree/Disagree?)
nither an altar boy, a virgin,or a boyscout have pure minds.
(reply to this comment)
| from Wolf
Thursday, December 09, 2004 - 03:14
  (Agree/Disagree?)
Joe, tell us, how is your “flatlander” approach compatible with “appetites that lead to the exploration of the unknown and the renovation of the known, and systematic challenges to inherited ideas, hackneyed knowledge, and accepted values”?
Or do you limit yourself to challenging ideas taught by TF?
(reply to this comment)
| From Joe H
Thursday, December 09, 2004, 09:41
(Agree/Disagree?)
I was challenging ideas taught by YOU. You gotta admit, your knowledge is a little hackneyed. I have an old book somewhere called Increase Your Psychic Power (or something to that effect). I believe it was printed in the 40s. I find its quaintness amusing, and I have it shelved under "Fiction - Early 20th Century" If you really want it, make me an offer. (reply to this comment) |
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | From neez
Thursday, December 09, 2004, 18:52
(Agree/Disagree?)
I think I may have a psychic link with my toaster. I have this habit of putting something in the oven & then forgetting all about it until the house is filled with thick black smoke. But whenever I put toast on, I always seem to know when its just about to pop.
Now I always thought it was something to do with the build up of the toasters electrical impulses somehow being sensed by my brains own electro-static properties. But I can see now how there could be some freaky holy-pocus going on. Maybe I project myself astrally into the kitchen to converse with the spirit of my toaster.(reply to this comment) |
| | | | | | | | | | | From Wolf
Thursday, December 09, 2004, 09:57
(Agree/Disagree?)
You didn’t challenge my ideas, rather the validity of my experiences. I actually couldn’t care less about psychic power and whether or not I have any. I simply try to find explanations for my experiences that are based on scientific principles as opposed to religious teachings. That said, I understand why you don’t believe me: If you’ve never had any paranormal experiences yourself, it’s only logical that you should question the authenticity of such claims.
As I see it, reasoning like yours actually drives people to religion for answers. No doubt a large percentage of this world’s population have had paranormal experiences; when scientists and other seemingly intelligent people tell them they’re weirdoes because they claim to experience things that cannot currently be explained, they turn to cult leaders, soothsayers and gurus for answers.
In contrast, truly great scientists like Albert Einstein put forward incredible hypotheses that are often very hard to believe, and in fact often wrong. Many of Einstein’s ideas have been proven wrong, but nonetheless his revolutionary thought greatly enriched human knowledge because he reasoned “out of the box”.(reply to this comment) |
| | From Marc
Thursday, December 09, 2004, 10:51
(Agree/Disagree?)
Now. Now. Hold on a minute here. "Many of Einstein's ideas have been proven wrong"? A _few_ of his theories have been found to be incomplete or maybe needing to be mathematically readjusted. I can think of only one of his many theories (as taught to us in physics class) which were eventually shown to be totally incompatible with our _current_ observations. Be careful when badgering a great mind like Einstein's.(reply to this comment) |
| | | | | From Marc
Thursday, December 09, 2004, 11:58
(Agree/Disagree?)
No. I understood your post. My only problem was your "Many of Einstein's ideas have been proven wrong" statement (the "many" part). I agree you weren't badgering him; wrong word. I initially thought it more like deprecating his ideas. I understand you were using his theoretical flaws (which were few) to make at point. The thought of people propagating the misconception that all of Einstein's ideas are no longer thought relevant is something I wish to dispel. A similar misconception is that none of Darwin's ideas about evolution are considered relevant today. He wasn't aware of genetics, however, his general ideas about speciation form the foundation of modern evolution.(reply to this comment) |
| | | | | from Vicky
Thursday, December 09, 2004 - 02:30
(Agree/Disagree?)
I agree with the main point made and I have contemplated related questions regarding psychological 'good health' versus 'dysfunction' on many occasions.
Being particularly interested in psychology and psychoanalysis, I've often pondered the irony of the fact that most if not all of those who work in this field are hopelessly screwed up themselves, or at least were at one time. I hate the presumptiousness and superiority with which mental health professionals purport to tell people how they should think or behave. I have read so many books on various aspects of psychotherapy where I ended up with the feeling that these supposedly knowledgeable, level-headed persons were really just hugely self-important individuals whose main goal was to make sure that they molded as many people into little mini-versions of themselves, with their own views and opinions, etc.
At the very core of the issue, I think, is the question of who decides what is healthy, normal and morally right. Many character traits or lifestyle choices that are still considered 'unhealthy', 'deviant' or 'screwed up' are looked upon in that light because of deeply ingrained notions of propriety which are heavily influenced by ridiculously outdated religious standards, and I am not going to allow myself to be judged by that kind of moral reasoning. I am aware that certain aspects of my personality have been laid down as a result of a rather mixed up upbringing, but in general I am quite happy with the way I have turned out. I am kind, I am sensible, I am responsible and a good parent. I lead a normal, boring life and don't get into much weirdness, in fact none at all these days. But I am aware that one side of me is attracted to many things which the average person might consider rather improper and maybe even just a little bit dysfunctional, but to that I say, who cares! What the hell does it matter? I find the notion that someone else should have the right to tell me how I should live my life detestable and I hope that I never allow myself be goaded into living someone else's idea of a healthy, good life. I think I know myself well enough to know when something is good for me and when it's not, and if I get out of hand at some point I believe I will be able to pull myself back and strike a better balance.
(reply to this comment)
| From GoldenMic
Thursday, December 09, 2004, 15:15
(Agree/Disagree?)
I like your thinking here, and I think Joe's point is well-taken. The truth is, as a counselor I have long understood that my field is psuedo-science at best, and pretty seriously invested in helping people become comfortable and adjusted to a life that doesn't make sense, in a world that isn't fair or balanced. Even as the field was being born, Freud was noting that the very purpose of civilization was basically to get everyone to repress their own pleasure urges in the interests of society's peaceful propogation, and at the expense of individuality (Civilization and Its Discontents) . Mike M.(reply to this comment) |
| | From Marc
Thursday, December 09, 2004, 15:53
(Agree/Disagree?)
I recommend that book, Civilization and Its Discontents, to everyone here. Freud does a good job at going against mainstream Christian thinking (thus, why they hate him so). Of course, Nietzsche's "The Antichrist" is even better! In fact, I would recommend all of Nietzsche's works (and note that I do not agree with everything he has written. It is just nice to read a different--contra-Christian--perspective).(reply to this comment) |
| | From thatata
Sunday, August 05, 2007, 10:23
(Agree/Disagree?)
A good counterattack or counterbalance to all that conformist psychology and psychotherapy would be :Surrealism.Surrealism wasnt just paintings it was also a tpye of movement.It had ideals and a kind of platform.It wanted to change life.The surrealists advocated instead of individual adjustment and conformity,social revolution.Of course that didnt happen,but its perspective on life,its cult of insubordination,its refusal to bow down to so-called real life,is a thing of real beauty.
Instead of trying to "cure" and "treat" people,they were interested in the manifest content of dreams.Like Baudelaires"make life beautiful!"
This was the surrealist thought"Why should art be just a compensation for the wretchedness of life?Why should it not become a means of imposing a change of circumstances?"
And how scientific is psychology anyway?(reply to this comment) |
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