|
|
 |
|
Getting On : Health
vaccination, may be lesser evil | from danak - Saturday, December 16, 2006
accessed 2616 times some pros for vaccination Hi!
I attentivly read the original article posted about vaccination and about dilemas parents have about the safety of it. As a doctor I had to learn the history of infectious diseases and all about them. Than I had to go through it again in pediatric exam. Ofcourse vaccination was major topic in this one. What I learned from history?
Smallpox was one of the most dangerous infectious diseases of the past. They claim that in seventeenth century one third of population in England died in smallpox epidemics. The reason I say was is that it was eradicated in 1977. How was it eradicated? With smallpox vaccina. Actualy vaccination and vaccina got the name from this victory.
Edward Jenner - English doctor in 18th century noticed that cow maids who had cowpox never got ill from smallpox. He innoculated (infected) people with cowpox so that they didn't get smallpox. Cowpox was mild form of disease but smallpox was often lethal. Vacca in latin means cow - so the procedure got name vaccination. If I had a picture of Jesus Christ on the wall I would put Edward Jenner's right beside it. He convinced king of England to vaccinate his daughters and afterwards nobility followed the example, then other citizens.... That was first large scale vaccination in history of Europe. Smallpox is also first disease eradicated thanks to vaccination. If you doubt how serious infectious diseases are, you should check the history of Americas and what happened to indigenous population after they came in contact with conquistadors. 90% of indigenous population died of infectious diseases like smallpox, measels, diphtheria, tuberculosis .....
Smallpox is viral disease and antibiotics are not effective. The only protection against lethal viral diseases is vaccination. That remains true till this day, becouse even today we have very few specific drugs to cure them.
I agree that there was less epidemics of infectious diseases becouse of better standard of living, hygiene and better nutrition. Still even in the beginning of twentieth century children were dying from diphtheria, tuberculosis, measels and let's not forget tetanus. All those diseases can be prevented with vaccinas except for tuberculosis. I agree that in most cases german measels is not such a bad disease, but if woman gets infected in first trimester of pregnancy the baby can be severly damaged - born blind, deaf, mentaly retarded, ..... I have to mention here that before the eruption of full blown case most of infectious diseases have incubation period in which even people who seem well are allready contagious for the people that they come in the contact with. So if young woman wasn't vaccinated against German measels or conntacted them as a child she is at risk to be infected without even knowing it.
Chicken pox is generaly mild disease for children. You scratch like hell and feel lousy, maybe have some scars afterwards but mostly you are ok. Not so for grown ups. Chicken pox can be very serious desease in a grown up person including menigitis and encephalitis among other things. One of my colleagues contacted it at work and she was hospitalised for a month. It's also extremely infective disease. When we were students in pediatric ward they were shouting after us all the time - close the doors! For a reason I assure you.
Shingles or Herpes zoster is reactivation of chicken pox virus in people who allready had the disease. Virus of chicken pox is never eradicated from the body once we get sick - it remains dormant in nerve roots. Another virus like that is herpes that also remains dormant in the body after disease is 'cured'. If our immunity falls it can reactivate - usualy in older or imunocompromised people (like AIDS patients). Shingles is not mortal disease but it can be extremly painful.
Mumps might not be so terrible for a kid even if extremly unpleasant but it can cause male infertility due to orchitis - inflamation of testicles. This is very rare complication but if it happens to your kid who cares if he is one case of 100 000?
Tetanus can be lethal disease, specialy in young children. And if it's not lethal, suffering of the patient during the whole ordeal is beyond description. I had misfortune to see a case of tetanus in three years old girl in India while I was working there in field hospital. Children in that rural area (around Poone) were mostly not vaccinated. Little girl stuck a pencil into her ear (that's what parents told us) and got cephalic tetanus. They brought her while se was allready in muscle spasms and had severe convulsions. We gave her imunoglobulines (antobodies) but it was allready too late. Tetanus bacterias are ubiquitous in soil. You can get tetanus with any kind of deep injury no matter how old you are. Even newborns can get it. If mother was vaccinated that protects newborn too becouse antibodies cross placenta. Tetanus is a good example why people should vaccinate. In this case booster doses are required.
Another good example is rabies. Luckily rabies is transmited by rabid animals like dogs, foxes, volves so it can be controlled to a certain degree. Vaccina was discovered by French chemist Luis Pasteur (anthrax vaccina was also discovered by him). I would put his picture beside Jenners on the wall. Dillema wheather vaccinate or not if you are exposed to rabies is null. Mortality is 100% and there is no cure. Rabies vaccina may have serious side effects but at least you can survive. Death from rabies is another thing I wish I'll never see again.
Measels can be lethal. But that's not all. Measels can leave serious complications including brain damage, blindness, ....
I agree that in some cases vaccina is not an absolute necessity but in other cases I do feel people are playing Russian roulette with lives of their kids. I would allways vaccinate against tetanus for one. I still get regular booster shots every ten years.
Among pictures on the wall I would mention Jonas Salk and Albert Sabin that discovered vaccina against polio. Polio can be very mild disease but it also can get you paralysed and some people die becouse of it. It's transmitted oraly with dirty hands. You never know how you will react to polio virus.
Same goes for hepatitis B, C. It can be mild, fluelike disease and it can put you to grave. You can get completly cured or you are carrier of the virus (and danger for other people) for the rest of your life. I know a case when boyfriend who was asymptomatic carrier infected his girlfriend. She died of fulminant hepatitis. She was sixteen years old.
It is true that today population si mostly vaccinated (except if you live in the third world country) so you don't risk a lot if your children aren't (but please dont' forget tetanus - it's in soil and we know where kids like to play and how easy they get injured). But if number of unvaccinated people will rise the danger of epidemics will also increase - we've seen some outbreakes of Diphtheria in Russia becouse of that. I can understand parents concern becouse of possible side effects. I know it happens but very rarely. In medicine we have to balance what is lesser evil every day - disease and possible consequences for a child or the cure and possible side effects. If population is vaccinated almost 100% like ours it is very difficult to prove that it was vaccina that caused autism. We know that children who were never vaccinated become autistic too. So is it coincidence or consequence? Both things happen at aproximatly the same period of lifetime - early childhood. If you do research on net you will find there are studies pro and contra as allways. Pharmaceutical companies are not trying to hide side effects - on the contrary. Every vaccina has liflet describing possible side effects and pediatrician has to describe them to you in detail. Decision for parents must be tough I agree. I hope I contributed a little bit to debate. I wish lots of health and joy to your children. |
|
|
|
|
Reader's comments on this article Add a new comment on this article |  from .
Tuesday, December 26, 2006 - 13:21
(Agree/Disagree?)
International award-winning filmmaker Kevin P. Miller of Well TV announced the release of a new documentary about the ... all » threat to medical freedom of choice. 'We Become Silent: The Last Days of Health Freedom' details the ongoing attempts by multinational pharmaceutical interests and giant food companies — in concert with the WTO, the WHO and others — to limit the public’s access to herbs, vitamins and other therapies.
'We Become Silent’ is narrated by Dame Judi Dench, the noted UK actress who has won multiple Golden Globe awards, an Oscar, and a Tony for her on-stage work, in addition to dozens of other honors throughout her prestigious career.
http://documentaries.ws/1/e107_plugins/content/content.php?content.434
stupitity
Albert Nerenberg – This documentary film sets out to determine whether our culture is hooked on deliberate ignorance as a strategy for success. Stupidity examines the "dumbing down" of contemporary culture, and reveals that, despite our extensive access to knowledge and information, humans continue to choose stupidity
http://documentaries.ws/1/e107_plugins/content/content.php?content.280
(reply to this comment)
| | | | from moon beam
Wednesday, December 20, 2006 - 14:16
(Agree/Disagree?)
Capitalism & Other Kids' Stuff 50 Minutes
http://documentaries.ws/1/e107_plugins/content/content.php?content.605
(reply to this comment)
| from AnnaH
Wednesday, December 20, 2006 - 12:56
 (Agree/Disagree?)
I'm hardly fit to be the representative for this site, but surely I'm not the only one who feels this way: I find your presence on this site to be intrusive.
You were not in the Family. You are not associated in any way with the family or ex-family members. Under the facts section number 1 says who this website was created for: “MovingOn.org was created for people born and/or raised in the religious group known as The Children of God or The Family. While the majority of participants are people who have left (hence the name Moving On,) second or third generation young people who still live in Family communes are welcome to participate on here as well."
"Friends and relatives of participants are also welcome here, as are those who were raised in other religious groups. However, the web site's primary purpose is to discuss life in and after the Family for those raised in it, so please keep the discussions topical and respect that this is “our space”.
Your being here is not exactly like a white man trying to join the Black Panthers, but rather like an Asian man trying to join them. Maybe the Asian man sympathizes with the Blacks and their persecution, their history of abuse, maybe he too has suffered oppression and knows how it feels, maybe he too hates the whites and he is certainly not the object of hatred of the Black Panthers. But he is not welcome because he is not black. He will never be black. He will never know what it is like to be black because while he may know the abuse the blacks have suffered, he has not experienced it. He has not experienced their hardships or their prejudice. Neither has he experienced the good times they may have had.
Of course, this site isn't only about the Family and we have many interesting conversations and debates about world issues, politics, music...or whatever else we care to talk about. This site is very unique and I've yet to see anything quite like it. But the greatest part of it is that it is a community: our community. These are people we are truly connected to, who I feel proud to be associated with if only through our horrible past. This is our only consolation prize: to know that as survivors of the Family we are not alone, we are welcome with many like us to listen and share our thoughts about the Family and life in general.
Please don't take this in a hostile way, you've been nothing but nice and respectful and I'm not angry with you. I don't blame you for wanting to be a part of this. I can appreciate that you are sympathetic to our plights and our histories. However, sympathy is not enough to make you a member.
I'm not going to suggest that we kick you off or ban you, or that we start demanding proof of relation to the Family before anyone comments. I'm just trying to make you see how your comments and articles might not be well-received by the rest of us.
(reply to this comment)
|  From openmind
Thursday, December 21, 2006, 03:21
(Agree/Disagree?)
yes and nobody ever will ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever understand us [sob] except for those who went thru' the same experiences... it's a harsh harsh world... others can drop by and try to make friends but no one will ever be able to fully comprehend what can only be felt... growing up in cult world was our initiation to life which is probably why there is an exclusivity among us here in this 'movingon' den ... to those who are non-exfam second generation members... you really missed out
.. we have each other to talk to... argue with ... and hug
although passers by are more than welcome in this mud pit it's great fun and there's plenty of space(reply to this comment) |
| | From danak
Thursday, December 21, 2006, 02:05
(Agree/Disagree?)
Dear Ana!
Before I ever posted anything on this site, I had this consideration – I am not one of them, I'll probably not be wellcome. Than I thought if contributions from non-exmembers are not wellcome, you won't post them – as simple as that. I also read one of of the Jules's comments who said that even if this site is created for ex members of the family it's an open forum. I respect Jules a lot, becouse even without knowing her personaly, it's obvious from her posts and commentaries that she is special person. I was never pretending to be one of you. On the contrary, I told you I was systemite right away. I also suggested not to read what I post if that bothers you. I wasn't writing about me living in the cult or any topic related to this. I have no experience with it. Your reprimand would be appropriate in that case. I also never pretended to be one of you or that I know how it feels to be you. I don't know. I was writing about vaccination becouse that's something I studied a lot and have some practical experience with. I thought you might be interested in other side of the coin, as we are talking about health of your children and youselves. I know what the family told you about it as I read the previous article. I wasn't looking for approval as it was obvious from the other articles under health page that more people will disaprove of it than aprove it. I probably shouldn't have bothered as it took me two hours to write it – but what the heck – what's done is done. I can understand how you feel – after all you are not the only one. England is full of exclusive clubs for members only and I never tried to join them. It's interesting new experience to be told that I am not wellcome to write not becouse of something I did or said but becouse of who I am (or who I am not more accuratly). I guess I was lucky it never happened to me before. I grew up in communism - I don't want to be member of anything, believe me. I am selective who I socialise with too. The difference is I tell them they are not wellcome becouse of what they did not becouse of what they are. If I don't like what they write I don't read them. Othervise black panters, stripes or no strpes, Asians, different cultures are all wellcome to exchange their experiences with me. That's the only way I learn smething new and It makes me think about things from other's perspective too. I find it extremely boring to socialize with my clones only. Telling me how you feel is not hostility, you just stated the fact. I am fine with it. Maybe you should post a warning at the beginning of this site clearly stating that other people's contributions or comments are not wellcome. It would make things clear in the very beginning and would save some bad feelings on your side and to the rest of us some time. You wont' have to kick me out or anything like that. Since I was a kid I was told not to go where I am not wanted and not to force people to bear my terrible personality if they don't fell like it. I won't post or comment on this site anymore – except for the brief comment to Oddman beneath this commentary. I hope that won't steer any more bad feelings. Finaly I wish you all the best and thanks for your company. I enjoyed it. (reply to this comment) |
| | | | | From rainy
Thursday, December 21, 2006, 03:33
(Agree/Disagree?)
I'm sorry you felt unwelcome Danak...I suppose it is hard to understand, but try and think of this site as a family reunion for us. We do welcome new friends, but we can really kick back and be ourselves in a unique way when there is only family around.
I actually welcome having feedback from people who stumble here once in a while...it's always interesting. I think what irked me about your article and comments though, was your assumption that we still think the way we were brought up to think. That after all your surfing and reading on this site, you couldn't see how intelligent and analytical we are, that you assumed we would think of you as a 'systemite', and that we would actually be against vaccination, and need convincing of its benefits!!! I doubt there's a single parent on this site who hasn't fully vaccinated their children.
I also didn't like all the sympathy...I don't know why that bothers me, maybe because I feel you see us as a curiosity, maybe because I think you don't know what you're talking about, or maybe because I'm so damn proud of all the posters on here, and I think everyone's come so far that I think any outsiders looking in should just be in awe at our strength, rather than feeling pity.
But don't pay me any mind. I know your heart is good, and I thank you for your sentiments.(reply to this comment) |
| | From nobody you would want to know
Sunday, December 24, 2006, 07:25
 (Agree/Disagree?)
if you treat people who are friendly to you like that how do you treat your enemies? whats the point of getting out of the cult children of the god to enter the cult ex members of children of the god .... ?
I doubt there's a single parent on this site who hasn't fully vaccinated their children. (quote from my rainy friend above)
look dude, have you read what your women were writing about vaccination in the other article? And their coments - it is obvious they do anything they are doing anything they can to avoid vaccinating their children and they are proud of it.
be hostile as much as you want - as if I cared doh(reply to this comment) |
| | From rainy
Monday, December 25, 2006, 00:52
(Agree/Disagree?)
Treat people like what? Showing her the courtesy of an honest explanation?
This site is (for some of us) our only connection with other ex-members. Even our own children will never understand where we've come from. 24 hours a day we live and work and socialise with people who will never know. What's wrong with wanting just one little online community of people who've been there too?
Like that comment about others vaccinating their children, this one is also me expressing what I imagine to also be true for most others, although obviously not correct in all cases, as we are not, as you would put it, an ex-member cult.
When have I ever been hostile? And WTF are you on?(reply to this comment) |
| | From nobody you would want to know
Monday, December 25, 2006, 09:16
(Agree/Disagree?)
Look dude - I read the article twice - if you haven't noticed, this was article about vaccination and not about 'oh I know how it feels to be you' one. I haven't found word pity in it or any kind of disrespect to you. So I really can't tell what you were talking about when you said she sees you as something strange? Where did that come from? She signed what she wrote, didn't she? Did she pretend to be ex member of cog? Did she post anonimously? If you feel this should be exclusive community than make it clear right on the front page 'just ex members can contribute, others shut up'! The fact that others can post on this site makes you better than The family and I respect you for it. Otherwise you have free choice to ignore whatever any non ex member of the cult writes. Nobody forces you to read or coment their posts. You can also decide not to publish stuff from non ex members of cog. Does being ex member of the cult excludes being nice to other people? Things can be said in many different ways. There are not many nice people around and I truly hate to see when they are cyber crucified just becouse they dared to post an article on the net. After all she did respect your decision didn't she? What I am on? I wouldn't give control over my life to anybody or anything, drugs included. So dude I am clean, how about you? (reply to this comment) |
| | From Shaka
Monday, December 25, 2006, 10:01
(Agree/Disagree?)
Who the fuck is this prick? Look dumbass, as you so thoroughly put it, this is a free website. We can say whatever the hell we want to anybody we want . Not only that but it's OUR website. Outsiders can come in and look around and post and chat and nobody's gonna tell them they have to go but we can still say whatthefuckever we want to them and they or you can't do a damn thing about it. I seriously doubt that danak got her panties in nearly as large a bunch as your whiney ass. What are you, the hall monitor? Nowhere does it say here that we have to be nice or sugarcoat what we think. And nobody said she was hiding anything or posing as an ex-cog so stop pulling shit out your ass. (reply to this comment) |
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | From rainy
Monday, December 25, 2006, 13:40
(Agree/Disagree?)
Okay, whatever...I was referring to both this and the other article and her comments in chat.
I have nothing against Danak or any other visitors - they are welcome. Just explaining how it feels to be examined like a specimen, especially on a forum where you've come to feel at home, or to be lectured on the most basic facts of health.
I do appreciate Danak taking the time to offer her support though.
And if you want to see hostile, just keep it coming.(reply to this comment) |
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | From Oddman
Wednesday, December 20, 2006, 16:16
(Agree/Disagree?)
Lucifer almighty, someone has issues! I feel the above comment was uncalled for. And a cowardly anonymous poster at that. I have issues with patronizing FGA's on this site, but I have no problem with "systemites" participating, so long as they respect the site and exers. I understand AnnaH's sentiments, and I agree this place is primarily for second generation ex-COG members. It looks like Danak has taken the time to check out the site, and hasn't so far been disrespectful or insensitive to us movingoners. Danak, I agree with AnnaH, it's important that you understand we grew up in a cult that has left us with scars that may never heal. Scars that can only be understood by those who bear them. It's just something that you can't really feel unless you've experienced it. Granted, a lot of the discussions are not related to TF, but they are opinions of exers, seen through exer eyes. I have no issues with the comments you've made (the ones I've seen). I hope you get to know about the dangers of the organization we were born into. I hope it prompts you to take action when you see victims or potential victims around you. I hope you enjoy the site. We can be a fun bunch, although I think most of us have at least one personality disorder. I just think many of us would prefer it if the regular contributors were exers who share our experience.(reply to this comment) |
| | | | | | | | from .
Wednesday, December 20, 2006 - 05:46
(Agree/Disagree?)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_proven_conspiracies
(reply to this comment)
| from Info
Wednesday, December 20, 2006 - 05:21
(Agree/Disagree?)
Vaccinations
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6890106663412840646&sourceid=docidfeed&hl=en
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=8610554679207090010&sourceid=docidfeed&hl=en
Meat and dairy causes cancer
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-1308977765978236346&sourceid=docidfeed&hl=en
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-2348910096409126100&sourceid=docidfeed&hl=en
(reply to this comment)
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | from danak
Tuesday, December 19, 2006 - 07:05
(Agree/Disagree?)
In 1918 after the first world war so called Spanish flu killed 20 million people. In the war itself 15 million soldiers and civilians were killed. Flu virus was worse killer than all so called civilized nations combined. Flu is viral disease - there is no cure. Tamiflu might help if we take it immediatly after infection but in full blown case you are on your own. I have my flu vaccina every year - but I would be crazy not to in my job. It's also recomended for people over 65. I never had any side effects after flue vaccina - actualy after any vaccina. I was vaccinated against tetanus, diphtheria, polio, measels, flu, whoping cough, hepatitis B and got antibodies against hepatitis A. I never had any side effects and never got sick from any of those diseases. However as a kid I got german measels, mumps, chicken pox, scarlatina - everything I wasn't vaccinated for. I wish there was vaccina for HIV, bird flu and hemorrhagic fevers like lhassa, marburg and ebola.
(reply to this comment)
| From nemo
Wednesday, January 10, 2007, 00:33
(Agree/Disagree?)
Actualy they say 50 million dead people worldwide at least - maybe even 100 million. People who don't get flu shots every year should understand that most diseases people call flu are actualy comon cold or some other kind of viral disease. Real flu is very serious disease and can be lethal even in era of modern medicine. It should be avoided at any cost if possible as it can cause serious long term problems like asthma, worse cognitive functions, problems with equilibrium and gait ... I visited our cementery today and noticed that most of people who lived and died in 19th century died before the age of 50 (specially women died young - probably many in childbirth). There were also lots of children who died of infectious diseases before the era of vaccination and antibiotics. I think people take everything for granted this days. Don't forget that people in the 19th century (and before) had herbal medicine, homeopathy, faith healing, christian science, 100% natural food, ..... but their children were still dying like crazy - in some regions of USA and Europe 60% of children never reached their 10th birthday - mostly becouse of infectious diseases. Even if you and your children stay in USA all your life, your neighbours and friends travel. People travel all over the world. With increasing number of unvaccinated people also rises the possibility of outbreak if somebody gets infected abroad and comes back in incubation period. Sure with modern medicine most of infected will survive but why not avoid it if possible? Anyway good job with the article! I loved it! Their loss if they kicked you out!
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/16194254/page/2/
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/16314899/(reply to this comment) |
| | | | | From Shaka
Tuesday, December 19, 2006, 09:27
(Agree/Disagree?)
The Spanish Flu and every other disaster in history was either nature being a bitch, bad luck, or human error. If it was Gawd sitting up there massacring innocents that would make him a sadistic bastard and if it was the Devil, that would make Gawd an inefectual idiot. Looking for a divine explanation for everything just keeps you happily ignorant of reality. (reply to this comment) |
| | | | | From danak
Tuesday, December 19, 2006, 12:43
(Agree/Disagree?)
as somebody who was raised by atheist parents and studied medicine that is completly based on science I would have to agree with you. Even Zerbi and Berg are pale in comparison to mother nature. No pity there. Only survival of the fittest. Yet many people do believe in God and they also believe in Devil. I think it's every person's choice what to believe. Nobody can prove for sure that God or Devil exist and nobody can prove for sure they don't. I leave my mind open. But if Devil exists he surely wouldn't eliminate such a fine servant as Berg was. Actualy the film Exorcist uses assyrian god Pazuzu as symbol of the devil - and Pazuzu was also master of infectious diseases in Mesopotamia. We are lucky we have never lived through the horror of full blown epidemics. In 15th century plague in europe killed every fourth inhabitant. Average life span in Firenze in the time of plague was 20 years. For me real benefactors of humanity are people who discovered vaccines and those who discovered antibiotics - like sir Alexander Fleming who discovered Penicilline and Gerhard Domagk who discovered sulphonamides. Is evil something that is inbred in people? I don't know. But I know some very good people - there is no malice in them. And I know some people who are evil to the core. Most of us are in between. Whatever the answer is I will be true to myself and when I will be judged - by people or God - I will not fail. Good luck Shaka! I keep my fingers crossed for you! (reply to this comment) |
| | | | | From danak
Wednesday, December 20, 2006, 04:56
(Agree/Disagree?)
if you saw that Indian girl dying becouse of tetanus you wouldn't say that. If it was your child dying of infectious disease you wouldn't say that. If you were dying from infectious disease - would you still think there is too many people in this world? Alexander Fleming saved my life twice (I had pneumonia as a baby that was cured by penicilline). I am happy to be alive - for me he is my benefactor. Also if you think there is too many people in this world there are many less painful ways to die than this. Yes, to me thery are benefactors even when I feel cynical. Remember them when they will save your life as well. (reply to this comment) |
| | From danak
Wednesday, December 20, 2006, 05:18
(Agree/Disagree?)
on the other side it is true that there was constant number of people in India before the British came and brought vaccinas, medicines ... They estimate it used to be 350 billion but more than half of children died before they reached age of ten. Now there is more than 100 billion people in India and surely modern medicine can be partly blamed for it, so does better standard of living. I do think that they will have less children when they will realise that they will survive childhood. The families that had at least too sons were open to birth control. I don't think anybody has 16 children they can't feed out of free choice. When people came to me for help dying I could help them many times, becouse of what they discovered many years ago. Yes I look up to them and many others. I do, I don't expect other people to do the same. (reply to this comment) |
| | | | | From danak
Wednesday, December 20, 2006, 08:34
(Agree/Disagree?)
Ehem devil's advocate - since when are biological warfare and traffic accidents poputlation control? I thought condomes, pills and other means of contraception were population control. Well I learn something new everyday. And if that's so you forgot some much more important ones like wars, drugs, famine, natural catastrophies (tsunamis, earthquakes, tornados), you shouldn't worry death is working full speed even without infectious diseases. I agree with you on one point though - nature has much less work with population control since she created man. Man is succesfuly exterminating other species too. Here si your vodka! Enjoy!(reply to this comment) |
| | From Lucifer's drunk cynicvocate
Wednesday, December 20, 2006, 10:08
(Agree/Disagree?)
That vodka was most refreshing, especially after the 1/2 bottle of absynthe and 12 cuppateas. I didn't mention the obvious natural catastrophies, because they are neither man-made nor new. Birth control alone won't solve the population problem. Third world countries with little birth control will keep producing too many people for their own country, and will end up exporting their product to the countries with effective birth control.
Aside from human inventions, nature will keep on coming up with stronger diseases to combat human immune systems, so the battle against diseases will never be won. Look at BSE, SARS, AIDS, Avian flu. Humans should think more about living their natural lives fully, rather than try and prolong a worthless existence. So you live a few decades longer, kill that many more animals and trees, what for? So you could watch a few extra episodes of Star Trek, and find out what happens to an aging Rocky?(reply to this comment) |
| | From danak
Wednesday, December 20, 2006, 10:47
(Agree/Disagree?)
Hey don't drink all vodka by yourself! I agree with you - nature will allways find the way to go around human imune system. New diseases will be born. But not only that. Old diseases will come back with vengance. We know that our drugs for some forms of tbc fail and we'll have to look for new cures, new vaccines all the time - but in doing so we are quite succesful. With modern drugs AIDS became quite manageable disease - that is if you have means to afford them. The problem with drugs is still their price which is too high for most developing coutries. I think I live my life fuly and that my existence will not be worthless even if prolonged. You can live wortless life at 20 and live meaningful life till you are 90 plus. I agree with you that in life quality is more important than quantity. But you know even something that seems worthless to you can be valuable to somebody else. Now pass that vodka! p.s. what's wrong with watching Star Trek(reply to this comment) |
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | from danak
Monday, December 18, 2006 - 11:32
(Agree/Disagree?)
I would like to add that smallpox is very important biological weapon. All the major powers have supply of it stashed somewhere. When generations from before 1977 will die humanity won't have immunity against smallpox (most of people don't have it today either). Most of doctors won't be able to recongise disease as they will never see the case before. Nobody will be vaccinated against it as there is no need. The only carrier is human. Luckily it's not as contagious as flu or chickenpox.
(reply to this comment)
| from
Monday, December 18, 2006 - 10:30
(Agree/Disagree?)
Vulvas are rabid?? I thought that there was something wrong with that 'wild' bitch I fucked the other night. I guess I better go do a shot or something, huh? :p
(reply to this comment)
| | | | | | | | | | From Oddman
Tuesday, December 19, 2006, 02:52
(Agree/Disagree?)
In some homes I've been to, it was almost like, "one kids got the flu", "dang, well, let's hope everyone get's it quick then it'll be over", "I'll go get the cooking oil". So the whole YC class got quarantined, even if some of us didn't have anything.(reply to this comment) |
| | From openmind
Tuesday, December 19, 2006, 23:26
(Agree/Disagree?)
... and another one of the nightmares was the (drumroll) sickwash! that's rite... the "Sickwash Bucket" (formerly used for laundry - formerly used for midnite pee pee - formerly used for doo doo diapers - formerly used for mopping the dining room - formerly used for weekly cleanup day and who knows what else). We had to soak dishes in this (usually blue) bucket of water that had a thick concentration of chlorine - the dishes were supposed to soak for 'half an hour' but more often than not they were left for several days too long. This would result in a nice layer of slime at the bottom of most cups... of course the name labels were either peeled off ... except for those dishes that the label became a part of the cup itself (in these cases, the name was bleached off anyways).
and WHAT THE FUCK IS WITH THE OVER USAGE OF BLEACH (CHLORINE, CLOROX, HAITER, ETC.)?????? Putting 4-15 drops (the amount varied according to each adult whoever was in charge of the drinking water supply)of bleach in each water bottle... I swear.... I probably got a nice pocket of bleach still somewhere in my kidneys or liver somewhere AAUURRGGHHEELLLPP!!!(reply to this comment) |
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |
|
|
|
|
(
]
[About the Trailer Park] [Who Links Here]