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Getting On : Family
How do we teach our children what we were never taught? | from cheeks - Wednesday, November 14, 2007
accessed 1154 times How do we teach our children tolerance when it was something we were never taught, and how do we get rid of those hangups that we were taught as children?
The other day in the car my nine year old daughter said that one of the children in her class-room was bi-sexual. I told her I thought he was too young to know that for sure and he may just be gay or unsure who he really liked as he was still young. She said, "No, Mom that's what one of the other kids in the class-room called him." I know it's what kids do, call each other names, say and do mean things to each other and somehow I as a parent need to guide her into a healthy balance between choosing her friends and not letting people use her. While it is easy to say once, I hope you never say something like that to someone. It is harder in my opinion to teach her to accept people for who and what they are.
And then there are still the hangups that I deal with, the whole Jewish issue being one of them. The anti-semantic rhetoric that we taught from birth that is so automatic for me to think of, he is rich so he must be a Jew. He is stingy he must be a Jew. The homophobic beliefs that we grew up with didn't stay with me long after I left, it was something I grew out of pretty quickly, but being in the south it is still very much an issue here.
So to other parents how do you have discussions with your children about peoples sexuality and acceptance of that sexuality? How do you talk with them about race and acceptance of other races? How do we cross over the issues that we were taught as children to make them healthy adults, so they don't struggle with the issues that we struggled with as children in the cult, and later as adults when we left? |
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Reader's comments on this article Add a new comment on this article |  from elisha717
Wednesday, May 07, 2008 - 12:39
(Agree/Disagree?)
I know this comment is a year too late! I am having the same question of what to say to my boy (11), I try to explain everything to him, but when it comes to that topic I just don't know what to say!! He has never had a girlfriend (it is not because he has something wrong with him!Lol!), but because he is interested in other things (like video games, being gross, camping, etc). I am so thankful that he has a normal kids reaction about things, he has no clue on this subject (i.e. we got him 2 hamsters [females only] one of them was pregnant when we got her [unknowing to us] so when my son discovers the babies he runs out yelling "I got lesbian hamsters", it was funny cause he really has no clue of what a lesbian is! So actually I still haven't told him anything, yet! I figure he can learn in his class room when they have that talk with him.
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|  From rainy
Wednesday, May 07, 2008, 13:09
(Agree/Disagree?)
Wow, you lasted till eleven without having "that talk"? My son (nearly six) is so curious about everything, and how babies get into their mummies' tummies in the first place is a big one. He has asked me SO many times. Each time I have told him a little more, and his questions have become a little more pointed. So now we're up to: "When a man and a woman fall in love something very special happens when they cuddle together and a baby can start growing in the woman's tummy." Of course he wants to know EXACTLY how this special cuddle is done, and I've told him that children don't understand yet and he must wait a while. "I WILL understand, Mum! Tell me!" "Not yet!" I really don't mind his questions and curiosity. I'm quite happy to answer everything. I've just left that final answer a little longer. But I'm sure it won't be long. He'll see animals mating or something I guess. I'm not worried about it. I'm certainly not leaving it up to the school system. I want him to know he can ask me ANYTHING. I enjoy discussing everything with him. That is the only question I've ever answered with "It's a little too adult for you just yet" which kills him. :) Your son may know more than you think.(reply to this comment) |
| | | | | | | | | | | From elisha717
Wednesday, May 07, 2008, 14:56
(Agree/Disagree?)
That is why I am so devided on this subject! Because here is the other side of the coin, "innosence is bliss" we were raised so liberal that we forget what stages our children really go through and what knowledge is really necessary and important for them to actually know. My son has never come out and asked me, but I put very little focuse on it, I tease him about having a girlfriend and so on, other than that I don't know if there really is a purpose to share all that info with him. I think the less I focus on that issue and just let him be a kid, and let him know that this issue is an adult issue and when he is old enough he will find out. As right now it really does not concern him, so why do I need to fill his mind with something that he is too young to experience anyway. We all were too aware of sex at such a young age, kids are supposed to think about other things!
So, I do have these conflicting thoughts and so I just kind of play it by ear at this point. (reply to this comment) |
| | From vix
Wednesday, May 07, 2008, 22:19
(Agree/Disagree?)
I don't think we were raised liberal, I think we were raised plain weird. Being liberal in one's thinking has nothing to do with child enslavement and rape and all the rest of the nonsense we were raised with. I agree with you that innocence is bliss but I don't equate lack of knowledge of what is, let's face it, a perfectly normal and functional act as innocence, or knowledge of the same as some kind of horrible burden that children should be without. The emotional ramifications of sex and the many ways in which it can take on less than healthy aspects is something else and children don't need to know much about that, but simply knowing the facts of life (men have a penis, women have a vagina, there are sperm and eggs involved, etc) is biology, plain and simple, and carries nothing negative with it.
I also believe that the more knowledgeable children are the less chance there is that they will be victimised. Knowledge is power and understanding is safety.
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| | From cheeks
Thursday, May 08, 2008, 21:44
(Agree/Disagree?)
I agree knowledge is power. I have not gone in depth as to how a baby is made regarding the male aspect of it, I have told them they need a male and a female to make a baby. More than anything else I have stressed to my kids if an adult makes them feel weird or uncomfortable in their tummy to get away. I believe in letting them develop good instincts as that will not only protect them now but in the future.(reply to this comment) |
| | From elisha717
Thursday, May 08, 2008, 04:57
(Agree/Disagree?)
What can I say when you are right!
When I talk about innosence, it is so nice for me to hear the boys think a girlfriend is a girl that gigles whenever she comes around them! I think they are at the right stage of where an 11yr old boy should be, (instead of us who were doing "God knows what when we were their age")!
I take them once or twice a week now roller-skating, and so I feel I am integrating them into a social and (in a way, kid-dating world)Lol!
Ever since my son was 5, I have told him that if he gets a girl pregnant he will be paying child-support until that kid is 18yrs. He is a numbers boy, and I know he hears what I am saying. But he never has point blank asked me. (reply to this comment) |
| | From murasaki
Wednesday, May 07, 2008, 17:30
(Agree/Disagree?)
I found using outside resources to be a great help when broaching these type of things, that way it's not coming from me, per se. My daughter is also very curious and we broached the topic about a year ago when she was about six and she wanted to know "exactly how do babies come out of the tummy". I got some books from the local library that illustrated everything in a very cute and simple, but also straightforward way. I also found a good book at a Christian bookstore that was a little less explicit, but still explanatory and geared toward that age group. I found this approach to work well for me and after the initial interest, my daughter has moved on to be interested in other things.
I'm not sure how I'd broach the topic in an older child, particularly if there is no interest on their part. But there must be some resources available that would be educational and politically correct for that age group. That way it's not coming from you, but it's just a factoid of life like everything else. (reply to this comment) |
| | From elisha717
Wednesday, May 07, 2008, 18:10
(Agree/Disagree?)
That is actually a very good idea! You know, I might try it this weekend! (there is two of them, step-child [I mean I love him just as much]).
I just took my final psych test (thank God she made it easy, I mean from what I am seeing in here, ya'll would've passed with out even studying), tomorrow is my last test for this semester!
So, ya, I'll have an interesting weekend! (reply to this comment) |
| | | | | | | | From elisha717
Wednesday, May 07, 2008, 13:41
(Agree/Disagree?)
Ya, you're probably right!! I mean he knows about girlfriends and boyfriends, he is being taught real well of how boys are supposed to be nice to girls and that they treat their girlfriend like a "queen," etc. I took him and my adopted son (same age) roller-skating, and they were so excited because they have girlfriends, so I asked them the normal questions and it turns out they don't even know their names or they barely even spoke to them. They were dicussing in the car what they were going to say next time they went.(reply to this comment) |
| | from ........
Sunday, November 18, 2007 - 11:23
(Agree/Disagree?)
I have been out as a lesbian for awhile now and have had several girlfriends my daughter has been introduced too, as well as one that lived with us for about a year. She has also seen her dad and I living together as a couple. I also have a lesbian couple as roommates. My daughter is also half black....I found the best way to deal with all these issues with her is to not make it an issue when i have a gay couple over I introduce them to her as such same with a straight couple. I have talked to her and so has her dad about mommy being white and daddy being black and her being a mix and told her that she is beautiful no matter what and so is anyother child thats another color. I hope that by treating it normally she will see it as such....I dont know what will happen when she starts school and other children influence her but maybe the acceptance she learns now will be something she stays true to.
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| from rainy
Saturday, November 17, 2007 - 05:11
(Agree/Disagree?)
I'm finding it a joyful adventure, teaching my son all the things I was never taught. Especially self- acceptance, self love, pride. Sometimes I think his childhood is too good to be true. This is how I always imagined a childhood could be. To give respect and ask his opinions and consult him. We do discuss morals and ethics at length, and have been through religion and Santa Claus. I've decided I respect him too much not to tell him the truth if he asks, which has led me to explaining sex much earlier than I wanted to. In a backlash against our early sex education, I wanted to keep him innocent as long as possible. But his questions were so specific and so often, and in every other area, whatever he asks, we dive into the science of it together, even if I have to research on the net to find out the answer! So I've even told him the basic facts of life now, and he's pretty cool and matter of fact about it. I think, the answer to your question is: THEY teach us how to teach what we were never taught. My son has taught me how to parent. I certainly didn't learn any of it from the way I was brought up.
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| from solemn
Friday, November 16, 2007 - 16:33
 (Agree/Disagree?)
Kids are shits.
That's all I have to say about it.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | from a thought
Thursday, November 15, 2007 - 23:38
(Agree/Disagree?)
you are a brave person and i admire you for caring about what you give to your kids
you wish well and that is a great start
AWARENESS of an anti-semitic upbringing is, I think, part of your battle already fought
I feel frustrated sometimes with the anti-semitism issue as it seems many well-meaning, kind-hearted people who were raised in the cult and would NEVER hate a jewish person, have the prejudices you mention, like "they're good with money" or "stingy" or whatever
i think i understand that you want to not have the prejudices we were raised with, and in that context your honesty is really heroic
(screw those who say this story has no heroes)
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| from clark
Thursday, November 15, 2007 - 13:39
(Agree/Disagree?)
I don't think being raised with such judgmental beliefs has made me lean that way. To the contrary. Leaving TF and being "different" has made it very easy for me to accept other "different" people. I actually care for them more than the "normal" ones because they, like me don't fit in that much.
I have an 11 year old and am bombarted with the same stuff she brings home from school. I use a lot of "what do you think about that?" responses for her and encourage her to think about the person instead of their label. Are they a good person? Are they kind to the other kids? Usually on her own she figures out that some of the most cruel kids in school are the most "accepted and popular."
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| from conan
Thursday, November 15, 2007 - 12:08
 (Agree/Disagree?)
I don't normally classify you as an idiot along with so many other scats on here, but now may be forced to change my opinion of you for the worse. The term is anti-Semitic, NOT anti-semantic! That is not a slip of the tongue but an enormous erroneous fuck-up that is just unforgivable to a Jew such as I happen to be.
That being said, your question is an exercise in redundancy. It doesn't matter what you were taught or how, but how you currently feel and how you convey those feelings to your offspring if you truly intend to raise them as tolerant, functional, accepting, charming little people in their world and environment. If your issue is that you don't know how to feel about certain issues of tolerance, i.e. race, religion, sexual orientation, social standing, etc., I understand.
I think it's fairly obvious that there is no set pattern of teaching that would be universally successful in the tolerance training of the youth as were that the case, we'd be raising a generation of socially petulant children or create a legacy of shining altruism that will go down in history as the most enlightened generation to date.
If your personal religious beliefs and views toward society were genuinely deformed by being raised in an environment of faux benevolence and underlying tension and discrimination, then your issues go way deeper than instilling the 'correct' views into your own children. It's a worthwhile introspective topic, but one whose public discussion will only cause deeper rifts, anger, confusion, misinterpretation, and or unbridled rage and anger.
By your own admission, you find yourself struggling to accept Jewish people or 'Jewish' stereotypes and so, in my opinion, your anti-Semitic self will be unable to genuinely convey an unadulterated view of broadminded permissiveness to your children, in at least the view of Jewish peoples and customs. Perhaps, as I am Jewish I never bought into the notion of the Jewish race being inferior or even 'a-moral' as I was supposed to have been ingrained to believe. If that's the case, perhaps I was given an unfair advantage when it comes to being accepting of other stereotypes, races, etc.
I'm by no means claiming myself enlightened when it comes to tolerance, but I can say that my own misguided bigotry is normally directed at the intellectually inferior (to myself) not to those of a different sexual orientation or race. I am clearly prejudiced when it comes to religious topics, but that is because I find religion to be an issue of intelligence (or lack thereof), not social standing or skin tone. I like to think that my own set of principals, however confused or unfounded are not based on some religiously charged vitriolic handed to be my a certifiable maniac and his 'family' of peons and underlings who strove all to hard to uphold his delusional rants and insane overtures.
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| From figaro
Friday, November 16, 2007, 20:05
(Agree/Disagree?)
"The term is anti-Semitic, NOT anti-semantic! That is not a slip of the tongue but an enormous erroneous fuck-up that is just unforgivable to a Jew such as I happen to be."
Before I risk looking like an idiot by commenting on this when I may be wrong in how I interpreted what you meant when you said this, please clarify for me what you meant, and why you said this. (reply to this comment) |
| | From a-b-c-d-e-f-g
Thursday, November 15, 2007, 22:16
(Agree/Disagree?)
I would not be so hard on someone specifically for the misspelling, when you are claiming to have your "own set of principals". Or maybe it's not a typo and you really *do* have your own set of headmasters/ headmisresses (as they say, it takes a school). I especially would not be so hard when claiming to have prejudices that appear to be related to education and/or perceived IQ (of which there are many types, not just one).(reply to this comment) |
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | from null
Thursday, November 15, 2007 - 06:17
(Agree/Disagree?)
It's an impossible task, I think we should all just kill ourselves
(reply to this comment)
| from J_P
Thursday, November 15, 2007 - 02:03
(Agree/Disagree?)
I realise this is not the point of your article, but I would strongly resent anyone refering to my children's (what should be non-existant) sexuality at all. Are other children referred to hetero-sexual? As non-sexual beings, I believe its wrong to refer to them in that way at all. They can't drive, vote or have sex, why can they determine that they have a particular sexual inclination, at least strong enough to know that they are "attracted sexually" to either male, female or both? Just as a child does not have a religion or political party preference on their own, I think the same would/should apply to how other aspects of their development are referred to.
Of course, if they grow up and develop a preference either way, that is completely their choice and as long as it is not harmful to themselves or others, why should I interfere at all?
Back to your original point, I find that I quickly got rid of many of my biases by questioning everything as a "process". Once I looked at things objectively, intentionally looking at all sides (as I saw it) I very quickly stopped being shocked by certain things or, IMO, lost my bias against many of the activities or so-called classes of people or activities which we were brought up with.
I try to bring up my kids in the same way. They must learn respect, but they must also question everything in an appropriate way to truly understand why things are the way they are and not just believe it because someone says so, even if its me that tells them.
My two cents.
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| from Big Sister
Wednesday, November 14, 2007 - 21:30
(Agree/Disagree?)
Look for good schools. In my children's school calling a kid "bi" as an insult would not be tolerated. This school defines itself as "a community where all individuals are respected, valued and encouraged to accept, appreciate and respect those who are different than they are."
Around the US there is also a strong anti-bullying movement. Several of my gay and lesbian friends who are parents do anti-bullying presentations in schools especially because they remember the hard times they had as kids.
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| from JohnnieWalker
Wednesday, November 14, 2007 - 20:15
(Agree/Disagree?)
Good question. I think if/when one of my daughters eventually brings up that subject or says something like that I might say something to the effect of, "That's just like saying he's left-handed or that he likes to eat his vegetables with sugar on them. There's nothing bad about it. It's just different."
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | From figaro
Thursday, November 15, 2007, 00:22
(Agree/Disagree?)
You have decided to become a Lesbian?? :'( {Heart breaks} lol, j/k :p
I don't have any kids, but I have, while living with them; helped some of my good single mother friends with parenting their children, one of which is almost like my son. And I have also wondered about this, and I went about teaching them the same way I taught MYSELF. Like was just said above, pointing out other instances where someone is different but not by any means inferior or superior really helped illustrate how not all that is different is bad, and simply telling the children it pretty much in that way! Also showing them how THEY are different from another kid and that that is ok, will help to make them think about how it would feel for someone else to be mean or tease them, just because of their differences. I just think it helps them put themselves in the other persons shoes.
But thats just my humble opinion. :)(reply to this comment) |
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