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from cheeks Wednesday, December 10, 2008 - 14:24 (Agree/Disagree?) I am going to be very honest, and you guys take it however you like. Younger Second Generation members tend to really annoy me. Esp ones that have been out a few years. I feel like I have been through the worst of what the Family had to offer. I have been through at least five TTP's before I was 16. I have read the pubs extensively. I know my subject. I often speak to members of the general public who come in our chat room and ask questions. I have talked to people in our government who have asked for personal information on various situations that happened in my childhood. I come here for entertainment purposes for the most part, but I have also spoken to many SGA's and SGT's that are still in the Family. I don't in anyway consider myself a spokes person for this site or for any community of us that have left. I speak only for myself. It annoys me when the younger Generation comes in here. And think they know what they are talking about. In my opinion you don't. Unless you have walked in my or your older brothers and sister shoes, you have no idea. It's like watching starving, naked children in Africa and think you know what that is like because your power was knocked out for a few hours last week. How many of us have watched psychologists, on TV after they have done a story on cults and pontificate on how we have developed mentally, what it was like for us in the cult, knowing they didn't know shit. Maybe your life wasn't freaking roses. Maybe your life sucked in the Family. But if you are ten years younger than I am you have no freaking clue how bad it was. If you spent more than half your life out of the Family, you have no idea of what it was like. No amount of reading up on the subject will ever do it justice esp if you were reading the GP or TRF pubs. I don't care how sold out your parents may have been, you were out. Unless you can say you were a half naked eleven year old that wore a sign on their neck for three months saying "Don't talk to me I am on silence restriction." Unless you were starved and beaten at the same age, unless you were sexually molested before you were ten, you have no freaking idea. (reply to this comment)

From colden Thursday, December 11, 2008, 13:25 (Agree/Disagree?)  I wore a sign that said "I'm too stupid to go down the stairs by my self please take me" which was added to my scilence restriction sign. I used to eat the bones off the plates when I was clearing the tables. The victor program I was in shut down before I caved. The teen cricket bat was my long term friend, though I could tell you why a tenis racket and electrical coard were much worse. I've got the scars, I've earned the right to speak my mind here! do you really think you are the only one that was molested as a child? where do you get off with that shit!(reply to this comment)

From cheeks Thursday, December 11, 2008, 17:55 (Agree/Disagree?) I wasn't talking to you. You are only three years younger than me not ten.(reply to this comment)

From colden Friday, December 12, 2008, 08:37 (Agree/Disagree?)  I think you are fat because you eat too much, not because you suffered some magical form of abuse that miraculously disappeared 10 years later (thats ten not three, that would be ridiculous).(reply to this comment)

From celestej Thursday, December 11, 2008, 15:26 (Agree/Disagree?) I think cheeks was referring to me as the segond generation member who annoys him.  I do realize that what I went through was not nearly as bad as what most of the older people on this site had to endure as children, and though I empathize I don't claim to fully understand all of those horrible experiences, or the scars they have left.  However, keep in mind that even after the Family "cleaned up their act" in fear of legal reprocussions, the abusive policies that had been in place for years did not magically disappear overnight, and most of what the younger second generation went through was also pretty awful.  From what I recall, there were still plenty of adults who thought that routine beatings, sexual fondling of children, silence restriction, etc., were still totally acceptable practices.  That being said, I am genuinely sorry for the traumas that you older people experienced as children.  Some of those people are my personal family.  Having lost a brother and watched my sister struggle with drugs and depression for years, I can tell you that it is much more painful to watch someone I love hurting than to experience pain myself, and if I could have borne any of it in their place I would have. (reply to this comment)

From cheeks Thursday, December 11, 2008, 17:53 (Agree/Disagree?) First of all I am a girl. While you may have sparked the comment, you are certainly not the first SGA I have spoken to who think they are completely enlightened on this issue. There are a lot of SGA's who come to this site who left at an early age and so missed a lot of the bad stuff. Please don't misunderstand me, I don't wish for a minute that any of you had. One of the reasons I believe so many young people can go to my conclusion, is because they were not abused like we were. Many older SGA's missed out as well because they were never invited to a TTC. I personally know of several who were lucky enough to escape. It is hard to believe what you have never seen. I don't believe that anyone ten years younger than me have ever been on silence restriction, or have actually been beaten. A spanking is something completely different and currently legal in my public school system. I believe there are currently children in the Family that are still being sexually molested because most of the main abusers have never left.(reply to this comment)

From celestej Thursday, December 11, 2008, 18:49 (Agree/Disagree?) I'll try to say this nicely, but come on, do you really believe that nobody younger than you ever experienced silence restriction, beatings, or sexual molestation?  I don't like to talk about my own experiences on this site because there are many more poeple (like colden, for instance) that experienced abuse for a longer period of time, but yes I was molested, beaten, emotionally and mentally abused.  Repeatedly.  Whether you believe it or not.  As were my friends who are younger than you.  Since we're sharing stories, I remember putting bandaids on my friends cuts and bruises after they were beaten, and being beaten so badly myself I wasn't allowed to go to a public beach for three weeks until my bruises healed.  I remember talking to two of my little ten-year-old girlfriends who were being molested by the same "uncle" as I was, and we were all too scared to tell anyone else. Honestly, I would think that someone that has been through so much would be more open-minded and have more empathy for other people.  And how can you believe that children are currently being molested in the Family, but there's no way that someone ten years younger than you could have suffered abuse?  I'm not holding a pity party for myself, by the way.  But I know whereof I speak.  I was born into the Family just like you.   (reply to this comment)

From cheeks Thursday, December 11, 2008, 19:15 (Agree/Disagree?) Until you can actually grasp the context of what I am saying I am not going to respond to any more of your comments. Like I said you may have had it bad in the Family, but it does not hold a candle to what the older ones went through. And honey the beating we had would never have been able to be covered by a band-aid. (reply to this comment)

From celestej Sunday, December 14, 2008, 02:40 (Agree/Disagree?) I already acknowledged the fact that what I went through was not as bad as what the older ones went through.  Did you respond to that comment without even reading it?(reply to this comment)

From placebo Sunday, December 14, 2008, 06:10 (Agree/Disagree?) Oh shut up the both of you already, my daddy is the best handyman in the world anyway!(reply to this comment)

From colden Friday, December 12, 2008, 08:50 (Agree/Disagree?)  How could any one ever hope to understand such deep thoughts from such a sad candle maker!  (reply to this comment)

From Netiquette Nazi Friday, December 12, 2008, 09:42 (Agree/Disagree?) You are attacking cheeks on her article for something that she said to you on another article.  It seems fair to assume that you are trying to start a flame war.  This is poor netiquette.  I know you're offended that cheeks singled you out, but I think you should just do what The Beatles sang- "Let It Be".When I (C)find myself in the (G) midst of flame wars, (Am) Netiquette Nazi (F)comes to me(C)Speaking words of (G)wisdom, Let it (F)Be (C- Dm7- C)And in my hour of mad(G)ness he is (Am) standing right in front (F) of me(C)Speaking words of (G)wisdom, Let it (F)Be (C- Dm7- C) Let It (Am)Be, Let It (G)Be, Let It Be, (F) Let It Be(C)whisper words of (G)wisdom, Let it (F)Be (C- Dm7- C) And when (C)all the opinion(G)-ated people (Am)living in the (F)world agree(C)There will be an (G)answer, Let it (F)Be (C- Dm7- C)For (C)though they might be (G)retarded there is (Am)still a chance (F) that they will see(C)There will be an (G)answer, Let it (F)Be (C- Dm7- C) Let it (Am)Be, Let it (G)Be, Let it Be, (F)Let it Be (C)(G)There will be an (G)answer, Let it (F)Be (C- Dm7- C)Let it (Am)Be, Let it (G)Be, Let it Be, (F)Let it Be (C)whisper words of (G)wisdom, Let it (F)Be (C- Dm7- C) Instrumental:| F C Dm7 C | F   C   | G F C . | F  C  | G F C . |  Let it (Am)Be, Let it (G)Be, Let it Be, (F)Let it Be(C)whisper words of (G)wisdom, Let it (F)Be (C- Dm7- C) And when (C)at night I’m (G)drunk and weary, (Am)Nazi has ad(F)-vice for me,(C)Post that thought to(G)-morrow, Let it (F)Be. (C- Dm7- C)I (C)wake up to the (G)sound of music, (Am)Netiquette Nazi (F)calls to me,(C)Speaking words of (G)wisdom, Let it (F)Be Let it (Am)Be, Let it (G)Be, Let it Be, (F)Let it Be(C)There will be an (G)answer, Let it (F)Be (C- Dm7- C)Let it (Am)Be, Let it (G)Be, Let it Be, (F)Let it Be(C)There will be an (G)answer, Let it (F)Be(C- Dm7- C) Let it (Am)Be, Let it (G)Be, Let it Be, (F)Let it Be(C)whisper words of (G)wisdom, Let it (F)Be | F  C  | G F C . |(reply to this comment)

From Encore Friday, December 12, 2008, 13:06 (Agree/Disagree?) When I (C)find myself in the (G) midst of flame wars, (Am) Netiquette Nazi (F)comes to me(C) Speaking words of (G)wisdom, Let it (F)Be (C- Dm7- C) And in my hour of mad(G)ness he is (Am) standing right in front (F) of me(C) Speaking words of (G)wisdom, Let it (F)Be (C- Dm7- C)  Let It (Am)Be, Let It (G)Be, Let It Be, (F) Let It Be (C)whisper words of (G)wisdom, Let it (F)Be (C- Dm7- C)    And when (C)all the opinion(G)-ated people (Am) living in the (F)world agree(C) There will be an (G)answer, Let it (F)Be (C- Dm7- C) For (C)though they might be (G)retarded there is (Am)still a chance (F) that they will see(C) There will be an (G)answer, Let it (F)Be (C- Dm7- C)  Let it (Am)Be, Let it (G)Be,  Let it Be, (F)Let it Be (C) (G)There will be an (G)answer, Let it (F)Be (C- Dm7- C) Let it (Am)Be, Let it (G)Be, Let it Be, (F)Let it Be (C) whisper words of (G)wisdom, Let it (F)Be (C- Dm7- C)  Instrumental:| F C Dm7 C | F   C   | G F C . | F  C  | G F C . |   Let it (Am)Be, Let it (G)Be, Let it Be, (F)Let it Be(C) whisper words of (G)wisdom, Let it (F)Be (C- Dm7- C)  And when (C)at night I’m (G)drunk and weary, (Am)Nazi has ad(F)-vice for me,(C) Post that thought to(G)-morrow, Let it (F)Be. (C- Dm7- C) I (C)wake up to the (G)sound of music, (Am)Netiquette Nazi (F)calls to me, (C)Speaking words of (G)wisdom, Let it (F)Be  Let it (Am)Be, Let it (G)Be, Let it Be, (F)Let it Be(C) There will be an (G)answer, Let it (F)Be (C- Dm7- C) Let it (Am)Be, Let it (G)Be, Let it Be, (F)Let it Be(C) There will be an (G)answer, Let it (F)Be(C- Dm7- C)  Let it (Am)Be, Let it (G)Be, Let it Be, (F)Let it Be(C) whisper words of (G)wisdom, Let it (F)Be | F  C  | G F C . |(reply to this comment)

from celestej Tuesday, December 09, 2008 - 19:04 (Agree/Disagree?) Ok, I appreciated most of the content of this article, except I'm not sure why you are asking ridiculous pointless questions, such as "why wasn't Eman excommunicated and prosecuted for what he did".  Really? Are you kidding?   Why weren't any of the thousands of sick, depraved abusive people in the Family prosecuted for any of thier heinous crimes?  I think that's what most of us here on this website are agreeing upon- justice was not served, nearly all of the abusers got away with it, and we're all pretty much united in our outrage on that subject.  Oh, even more ludicrous, "If Berg was truly a prophet, wouldn't he have known...."  Sweetie, I highly doubt you have to convince any of us that Berg was not an anointed prophet but rather a demented pedophile.  Not exactly a newsflash.  Since you feel the need to be so redundant, maybe you should log on to Myconclusion.org and share some of your brilliant insight with them.  At least you'll be telling someone something they don't already know. (reply to this comment)

From cheeks Tuesday, December 09, 2008, 21:11 (Agree/Disagree?) WOW. I just don't really know what to say. I guess this completely proves the point of the article. SGA's who grew up later on in the Family don't have a clue to what went on. Certainly one that left when they were twelve even more so. I obviously know the answers to the questions I posed. Perhaps a teenager in the Family, or one like you, who grew up with little actual Family history and basically only know the white washed truth that you were presented. May come across this article and wonder why they never heard that particular story. All of the issues were actually published in different pubs and unless you were a prolific reader and had a good memory, you may not have remembered that Berg kicked Gen out because of her baby. You probably never even heard of Gen and had no idea of the months of fasting she went through because of her idiot child abusing husband. Years later when Eman actually confessed in a completely unrelated pub most every one in the Family either chose to ignore what happened in Bergs home or forgot it completely and could not put the puzzle pieces together. Perhaps a Jett, teen or SGA in the Family will read this article and wonder what the hell was wrong with Berg, God's supposed prophet. Perhaps they will wonder what else he got wrong. Or perhaps they will come here and like you, it will go completely over their heads. And they will continue to live in ignorance supporting a false prophetess and devoting their whole lives to a lie.(reply to this comment)

From celestej Wednesday, December 10, 2008, 03:23 (Agree/Disagree?) Little family history?  Give me a break.  Almost all of my childhood memories are involved with or tainted by the family, in spite of the fact that I'm younger than many of you.  And after we left I learned even more about it from my parents (My mom is still supportive of the Family, by the way) and my fifteen brothers and sisters (all born in the family), thier parents, my friends who were involved, my siblings friends who were involved, this website-  So I would say I'm pretty well educated about it.  I had already heard a vague version of the Gen story, which you clarified.  Nothing has gone over my head.  Seriously, get on Myconclusion if you really want to talk to family supporters.  I'm sure thier deluded ignorance will infuriate you.  We here are all pretty enlightened already.   (reply to this comment)

From cheeks Wednesday, December 10, 2008, 13:49 (Agree/Disagree?) You seem to forget that many current SGA's and teens that are still in the Family come to our site. They come in our chat room and they read our articles. You have been here eight months or so. I have been here five years. Don't lecture me on where to put my articles. When this article was written a year and a half before you even came to this site. (reply to this comment)

From ha ha Saturday, December 13, 2008, 12:13 (Agree/Disagree?) (reply to this comment)

From Samuel Tuesday, December 09, 2008, 20:13 (Agree/Disagree?) This article is two years old, celeste, if that helps any.  It looks like colden got upset that she called him out for criticizing someone else's poetry yesterday, and decided to seek revenge by digging up her old articles and writing negative comments.  I can assure you, cheeks is not a member of The Family, and while she might be able to bring some good sense into the myconclusion.org website, I would advise against going there simply to avoid the frustration and irrational thinking being expressed by their members. I am of the belief that cheeks was putting out good questions that have not been answered.  Of course we now know the answers, and I do believe cheeks knows the answers better than some others of us, but it would still be nice to hear The Family answer them.  Just because I am still of the belief that people really are good at heart and if most members knew the truth about The Family there would be a mass exodus. Good night.  (reply to this comment)

from colden Tuesday, December 09, 2008 - 14:33 (Agree/Disagree?)  Don't start what you can't finish cheeks! if you don't want to argue stop posting comments on my shit! this will be my last on yours. (reply to this comment)

From cheeks Tuesday, December 09, 2008, 15:33 (Agree/Disagree?) I highly doubt it. You are filled with your own self importance. You put down someones article when all of yours have been just as shitty. I hate making this site more of what it has been the past four months or so, by dragging on useless arguments. But if you want to play, lets play. I'm not afraid of you. You are relatively new to this site, I doubt you will be here in six months. Most newbies who comment and write tons of useless articles don't stay too long. When this article was written it fit the general pattern of what was being discussed. It also fit with something that was going on in my personal life. Which is why I asked the opinion of the community at the time. It may not be relevant now, but that is ok with me.(reply to this comment)

From colden Tuesday, December 09, 2008, 16:30 (Agree/Disagree?)  The problem I had with that love article is it was riped from something we were forced to read in the family called "love is..", I did feel my comments  may have been harsh but after reading another of her articles which was like Hallmark being gang raped by a buch of retarded clowns I have decided that my original comment stands. I'm not breaking my word here but if you really like my thorn in your side.....(reply to this comment)

From colden Tuesday, December 09, 2008, 16:34 (Agree/Disagree?)  For the record I am not talking about a "cheeks" article here, the other posts are, of course but not this one.(reply to this comment)

from colden Monday, December 08, 2008 - 15:56 (Agree/Disagree?)  You want to talk about Rickys story being our own but don't want to bring up his story? how noble of you! and why are you rereading family literature any way? feeling nostalgic are we? (reply to this comment)

From cheeks Monday, December 08, 2008, 19:48 (Agree/Disagree?) This was a very difficult time for me. I don't think I have really gotten over Ricky's death. I never personally met him. We knew so much about him and yet we never knew him. I don't feel like I have the right to talk about him and his experiences as there are people on this site that are so much better qualified. I better understand why Children who are the victims of abuse are shielded from the media, their faces covered, or blurred so they can cross over to adulthood in anonymity. He was never given that. I struggle with this issue still, Ricky is dead, he cannot defend himself, he cannot comment on the things we write, he cannot redefine the stories about him. While things that he went through in childhood bled through into mine. His story is uniquely his. Who am I to comment on it. Am I sometimes nostalgic about the time I spent in the Family? I would be lying if I said no. I do sometimes miss the friends I had in. I do go back there once in a while and relive my memories. When times were more simplistic. I do miss, on occasion, sneaking the home made wine out of the brewing tub and sitting on the balcony with my closest friends getting skunk drunk, and the adults being none the wiser. It is not the same as having a glass of wine by yourself in the evening. It's not the reason I reread some of the Family pubs. That is none of your business. But if you must know, I do it so that I never forget where I came from and what made me who I am. I do it so when people ask me questions I am informed and don't struggle to remember something I read twelve years ago. (reply to this comment)

From colden Monday, December 08, 2008, 20:56 (Agree/Disagree?)  Complicating "simpler times" into "when times were more simplistic" is a lot like reading mo letters so you can rember to tell people things were crazzy in the family when they ask or saying you don't feel we have a right to talk about him on this post you made about him, is all this really too subtle for you? (reply to this comment)

From cheeks Tuesday, December 09, 2008, 07:30 (Agree/Disagree?) I really don't want to spend a lot of time arguing or explaining things to you. You obviously, only looked up my posts so you could find something derogative to say. You have not awed me with your brilliance, quite the opposite actually. What you say or think really does not mean anything to me. I don't know you, and even if I did I don't think I would like you. People, teens like you in the Family, were the thorns in my side I would rather not remember. The tattle tells who would run to the Shepherds every time one of us stepped out of line. So they could look more important, more spiritual to the Shepherds. I was never one of you. I certainly am not going to start now. (reply to this comment)

From colden Tuesday, December 09, 2008, 14:17 (Agree/Disagree?)  People like me? you presume too much.(reply to this comment)

from mugthebug Wednesday, January 11, 2006 - 18:15 (Agree/Disagree?) glad to see you figured out the edit and psted the rest of your artical i was starting to worry if you had had too many martoonies :D (reply to this comment)

From cheeks Wednesday, January 11, 2006, 18:28 (Agree/Disagree?) Never too many, shake shake.(reply to this comment)

from vixen Tuesday, January 10, 2006 - 04:37 (Agree/Disagree?) Just so you know (although you might already be aware of this), there is an option to edit your article, if you wanted to add more to it. :-) (reply to this comment)

from mugthebug Monday, January 09, 2006 - 21:02 (Agree/Disagree?) did you not finish your artical dearie? (reply to this comment)

From Jonni Tuesday, January 10, 2006, 13:17 (Agree/Disagree?) nice one cheeks, its good to hear someone say something sincere even if its half finished :-) Its difficult for people who didnt experience things directly and sometimes its more convenient for people to ignore the obvious. there are people i lived with who were in the next room when i was getting whipped and having the crap kicked out of me who now say they dont remember a thing. Some people find it easier just to pretend it never happened. some of the younger gen have proably been told over and over again that were liers and trouble causers. well said cheeks. (reply to this comment)