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Getting Out : Inside Out
Attacking the Family Care Foundation is counter-productive | from Wolf - Saturday, July 19, 2003
accessed 5722 times Go ahead, call me whatever you’re thinking: cult sympathizer, jellyfish, brainless – now that we’ve gotten that out of the way, give me a moment to explain why I think it’s counter-productive to attack the Family Care Foundation: The Family Care Foundation is a US public charity, and as such is subject to US government regulations and independent audits. The FCF management live much closer to the “real world” than Zerby and Kelly, and they are aware that FCF projects need to keep their activities in check in order to conform to FCF tax exempt charitable activities. As long as the Family continues to exist, having a legal front such as the FCF will help communities affiliated with the FCF avoid illegal and harmful activities. The more Family members become involved in legitimate charity activities, the more they will realize that Zerby and Kelly have a few screws loose.
Forcing the FCF to disband would be counter-productive because Family members who are currently involved in FCF projects would retreat further into their shells, and ZK & co would have one more reason to convince them that the “big bad world” is “persecuting” them and they should turn to mother hen for protection.
I will shed no tears if the Family unravels, but I would certainly not actively promote it’s dissolution, especially if it involves inflicting suffering on ordinary Family members, many of whom are sincerely trying to make a difference for the better. To me the most important issues are:
• Helping Family members see the truth about Berg, Zerby, Kelly and other leadership.
• Enabling children in the Family to receive a real education.
• Opening the Family to outside influences, which will cause Family members to realize that harmful and ridiculous beliefs are harmful and ridiculous, and generally make the Family more susceptible to the positive legal scrutiny that ordinary members of society are subject to.
In my opinion the FCF’s existance would play a positive role in the above changes taking place.
By the way, I’m not a member of the FCF or the Family.
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Reader's comments on this article Add a new comment on this article |  from juliez
Saturday, February 19, 2005 - 22:32
(Agree/Disagree?)
I would prefer that the "Family" stay far away from me and my daughter.
They are a danger to the public. How can you think of trusting people that participated or observed child abuse.
They are not Christian, and should be tending to their children instead of playing cult games. I think they should stay out of the USA, cause we are all a little tired of their BULL SHIT.
(reply to this comment)
| from chokehold
Saturday, January 31, 2004 - 10:14
(Agree/Disagree?)
...anyone know what the 'East Europe Christian Correspondance Centre' actually does? In 1998 the FCF gave them $50,400. Must be one good project!!
(reply to this comment)
| | | | from chokehold
Monday, January 19, 2004 - 06:32
(Agree/Disagree?)
Do you think it would be possible to find out why exactly all the American projects were shut down? Apparently there were hundreds of them and then they vanished, would FCF have to disclose this information if they were asked or could it be found in the minutes?
It must be in some public record somewhere anyway, a
Any journalists on this board?
(reply to this comment)
|  From Wolf
Monday, January 19, 2004, 11:33
(Agree/Disagree?)
From what I remember there were a number of reasons, but I think the main one was illicit solicitation of charitable donations. As you may know US charities have to be registered in each State where they solicit, and they have to follow certain procedures. Of course Family members don’t follow those procedures and don’t give a f-k whether or not they’re registered to solicit. I think the FCF told all their US projects to quit soliciting in FCF’s name but they wouldn’t listen so FCF just cut them all off. My guess is that FCF got a warning letter from someone.
FCF had some stock reason that they told everyone, if you’re really interested you can ask them and they’ll probably tell you.
(reply to this comment) |
| | from chokehold
Friday, January 16, 2004 - 15:01
(Agree/Disagree?)
Interesting...can you apply to have the minutes of meetings of charities registered in the US sent to you or do you need to donate to them first? Nancy?
It might be a way of understanding what exactly is going on within the FCF.
(reply to this comment)
| From Nancy
Friday, January 16, 2004, 15:50
(Agree/Disagree?)
Let me find out. My first impression is such documents are public record. Yet, understand, that a lot of small corporations, which are not publically held, have a firm draw up some fake minutes for some fake shareholders meeting once a year. It's just formality. Besides, the minutes of the FCF are just to comply with their status and would have nothing to do with what's really going on. That is dictated, as we all know, by Zerby and Kelly.(reply to this comment) |
| | from Sonderval
Friday, January 16, 2004 - 10:24
(Agree/Disagree?)
Heh, just to throw in my tuppence worth here, fiddling books for a charity is how I first got started in accounts (they weren't crooks, just horribly disorganised), it's brutally easy, for instance auditors will actually accept hand written receipts on headed paper as petty cash receipts in most cases, do you have any idea how much leeway this gives you? Creating paper trails is easy, as far as audits are concerned I could balance any set of books, no matter how crooked, being a registered charity means next to nothing.
FCF provides a legitimate front for the family, the only way they could be effectively attacked is if there was evidence of wrongdoing within FCF and they were taken to court, and surely if that's the case then they're not really doing a lot of good?
I personally would argue the good they are doing as well, it takes more than paying a few ethnic kids to pose for PR photos to impress me I'm afraid, and I'm pretty sure that whatever good they are doing could be done more effectively by the money being used by a legitimate charity without ties (by ties I mean they are completely owned by them) to a weird cult that most people here have had first hand experience of and know to be a haven for abusers of many kinds and a financial black hole.
What am I doing??? Surely nobody is taking this article seriously anyway, meh, think I'll quit shooting fish in a barrel and go do some work.
(reply to this comment)
| From highonhigh
Friday, January 16, 2004, 14:03
 (Agree/Disagree?)
Anyone giving to any project run by TF is helping to kill the future of all the children that are still in TF. All their so called good works are crap because they denied their own children the freedom of choice to be well educated. All the children inside TF has to put up with a mediocre type of education & if one day they decided to leave they will encounter all the difficulties we had to face when we left. So to anyone that help giving food, shelter, money or whatever they give, they will also be responsible for furthering the lying & decitful life style of all those still in the cult.
Cut their income & their religion & "good works" will be good for nothing.(reply to this comment) |
| | from chokehold
Friday, January 16, 2004 - 09:49
(Agree/Disagree?)
Which if any of the FCF projects are run by non-Family members?
(reply to this comment)
| from chokehold
Thursday, January 08, 2004 - 18:54
(Agree/Disagree?)
Which of the FCF projects aren't run by current or exfamily members? Names and locations?
(reply to this comment)
| from Laiah
Monday, December 22, 2003 - 14:09
 (Agree/Disagree?)
I would just like to say that as a current member of the Family and someone who benefits from FCF: They are very much two separate entities. Of course all members of FCFs staff are fulltime members of the Family but they work very hard at their job. They used to withhold 10% of donations received for projects for administration costs but have now eliminated this so that all projects receive 100% of money sent to them to be used for their said projects. They require detailed reports and are careful to not allow projects to be fraudulent. This was a big concern for us as second-generation members who have seen things slide by.
FCF is not The Family and is working hard to help small projects all over the world. Until you have done the same- don't throw stones of any size.
(reply to this comment)
| From sarafina
Monday, December 22, 2003, 16:22
(Agree/Disagree?)
First you say " Of course all members of FCFs staff are fulltime members of the Family " Then you say you say "FCF is not The Family." So its not the family but the family basically runs it and is in charge of it?..so really it's quite the same thing. The other thing is you say is" the FCF is working hard to help small projects all over the world" Well my point again is here they are trying to "look good" in the publics eyes by sending money to the poor and funding all these outreach programs and saving lost souls ..when in my opinion they should be helping their own children!
And as far as your comment of "Until you have done the same- don't throw stones of any size. " If that's the case most of us would be able to throw all the stones we want! I myself served in the family for 18yrs! I've lived in over 6 different countries including 3rd world counties most of my time. I've worked in the PR department , outreach, witnessing (pan handling) spent hrs on my feet as a child and teen going door to door, I can't even tell you how many "souls I've saved" I was a poster/ tapenessing shiner and sung in many singing groups, did skits, charity events and such.
So I know what I'm talking about. After yrs of serves they have never done nothing to ever help me or my family. My parents spent 20 dedicated yrs in the family and never received any help.They were left to struggle with 10 kids and are still struggling to this day. Another friend of mine who also was a teen born in the family got excommunicated for a yr for some stupid thing and had spent 22yrs in the family they kicked him out without anything not a dime no help or anything. He had no family outside and had never had a job or education other then the tiny bit he received and he was left to fend for himself.Where is the justice where is the loyalty? So here are those who spent yrs in serves but because we decide it is not our "calling" and leave we are despised and shun and prayed against. What hypocrites! So what, because our families are no longer in Africa or India they aren't "worthy" ? That money should go to helping their children with a start in life and their education, they deserve it after all their years of having to forsake all and all the hard work for they did for the family.(reply to this comment) |
| | | | | | | | From Joe H
Monday, December 22, 2003, 15:01
(Agree/Disagree?)
I'm not really sure if I should indulge in an ad hominem* here, but I'm hungover so what the hell:
You've been on here repeatedly in the last few months, basically on the fence - not too keen on cults but too chicken to brave the real world. I'm reminded of that verse about hot or cold: "... because ye are lukewarm I will spew you out of my mouth." Figure it out already!
*ad hominem: attacking an arguer instead of his or her argument. (reply to this comment) |
| | From frmrjoyish
Monday, December 22, 2003, 14:31
(Agree/Disagree?)
The FCF is nothing more than another front by your perverted cult in an attempt to cover up your true nature and identity. Just one in the long list of religious "charities" trying to milk money from taxpayers like myself in order to furthur your religious fantasies. TF has never amounted to anything other than a bunch of child abusing wannabe missionaries who are too caught up in their la la land of "prophecy" and "loving Jesus with spiritual vagina's" to be any help to society at all. Thus the need for all these fronts you put on!
So..until you have actually been out in the real world and seen what it means to truly be a contributing usefull member of society, not a blood sucking, welfare milking, decietful cult member, you can take your perverbial stones and shove them up your you know what!!!!!(reply to this comment) |
| | From Nancy
Monday, December 22, 2003, 14:29
(Agree/Disagree?)
Does anyone else see the stupidity of this post? "Of course all members of FCFs staff are fulltime members of the Family." Enough said! Thanks Laiah! You make our argument for us! It's just another front for the same cult. You can take all the "detailed reports" you want, and it will not alter that fact.
It's so strange to see how deluded these cult members are. They aren't even capable of following a logical argument. They prove their opponents points by their incapacity to reason and think on their own. We should send this to the CFC director as further evidence of the reports we made previously.
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| | | | | | | | | | | from sarafina
Monday, December 22, 2003 - 13:45
(Agree/Disagree?)
I completely disagree with you on this one Wolf and I think Albatross has explained my feelings on the subject more clearly then I can.
The FCF is just another public front for the family. Sure there is some good being done but ultimately that "good" is supporting the evil. For one the FCF stands for the complete opposite of what TF is. On the FCF page it states "FCF lends a strong voice internationally, speaking out for human dignity, economic justice, moral values, and civic responsibility." This coming from people who have NO morals, NO respect for the law or for their OWN children. I've always hated how they are so willing to help other kids and "save the world" while their own are suffering.
It would be great if the FCF could continue doing its good but there needs to be a separation from TF. Not to mention I bet also that a lot of money goes to support the family and its leadership. Just like with the Red Cross situation ,Yes the red cross was doing a lot of good but a lot of the money being donated was going to pay the CEO's $400,000 salary. So even though they are a "Official" Charity there are all sorts ways to cover where the money is really going. As far as you wondering if the FCF is part of the family.The president of the FCF was a CRO for years and still is living in a Home close by he is still a huge leader in TF. Many of us know him well. Not to mention those working close with him are also other family leaders or were at one time. The FCF is nothing new it's just like any other outreach program they ever had all the way from Music w/ Meaning to the kiddy vidies and Aurora Productions, The Puppet shows, Heavens Magic and every other public front only on a lager scale. Don't you think the people who are donating have a right to know who's really behind it all and what they really stand for? I think they'd be pretty angry to find out they were decived and have been helping to suport a cult who does anything but believe in "childrens rights, or children labor laws" and continues to use their children to make them money.
Those who are w/ the FCF yet still in the family should be removed as they by being in the family are still supporting and condoning it's evil and following the prophecies and orders of a child abuser and metal ill woman. Doesn't matter if they themselves aren't at fault they should leave and serve God outside of the family then but by staying in they are supporting it's evil. Surfer I don't know about you but I am certainly not try to win the family's trust and I understand it's hard as you have family still in so do I and Daniel and a lot of us maybe by making things harder on them it will give them more reason to leave.
(reply to this comment)
| from surfer
Thursday, December 18, 2003 - 20:41
(Agree/Disagree?)
I agree with Wolf. I think that attacking FCF is counter productive because it will probably just create more paranoia and add to "us against the world" mentality. I would like to have a better relationship with my parents and if it turned out that FCF was closed down as a result of second generation ex-members, it would create more distrust and most importantly, they would probably make it harder for me to communicate with my younger brother who is still in the Family. I definitely see both sides to this argument and hell I would like to see some kind of retribution against Zerby and co. I think there just has to be a better way. Stopping FCF will not make the leadership disappear, but it will hurt the people like my parents who are still in.
(reply to this comment)
| From exister
Monday, December 22, 2003, 12:37
(Agree/Disagree?)
surfer,
My parents and all my siblings are also still in the family. Now let's have a John Lennon moment and "imagine." Imagine a world in which this perverse and evil organization no longer exists. Our parents can continue to be missionaries if they wish, or they can get jobs. They don't have to filter all communication with us through some paranoid screen of family security. I venture to say that in this world our relationships with our parents would be significantly better. At least we would be speaking the same language.
Your current position is that the family will always have your relatives in its clutches and the best you can do is reach some sort of truce. I used to think this way until I realized we can do better. All of you who still think this way have already been defeated. You have given up hope for a better time in which the family is no more.
Some of you may think that people like Daniel and myself are brash and confrontational, but the truth is that we have realized that we have no choice but to attack. In the past few months I became acutely aware of the huge amount of suffering and illness wrought by the family. Thousands of my generation were raped and brutalized in childhood. I realized that to do anything less than attack this evil organization in every way would make me less of a human being. I answer to no authorty beyond my own humanity and it demands a complete assault! (reply to this comment) |
| | From Albatross
Thursday, December 18, 2003, 22:06
(Agree/Disagree?)
It will hurt the leadership. And when they move on elsewhere, we will follow them there. How could TF be any more paranoid than they already are? It IS them against the world. Why is it incumbent upon us the Second Generation to hold back while they mistreat us, insult us, and ignore the pain they've caused us, while they hold contact with them and our siblings over our head like some turkish delight which we will only get if we behave. Let them ROT I say. It is we who should be setting the tone and making the demands. Why must we be the ones always reaching out. If we make a success of ourselves and starve them, then they will have no option but to reach out. Remember, at their core they are moochers and leaches. Fire their nests, burn out their dens, flood their burrows. Expose their christianity for what it is, a cloak to hide their fantasy land of demons, kings and queens. Expose them for the unrepentant child abusers and destroyers of innocence that they are. Why must we simper and cower behind the labels they so calculatingly throw at us? It is they who should run and hide. It is they who should hide their faces in shame!(reply to this comment) |
| | From Wolf
Friday, December 19, 2003, 00:01
 (Agree/Disagree?)
It is with great respect that I reply to your post, because you’ve written some of the most intelligent comments I’ve seen on this site.
How will the ruination of the FCF as an organization hurt cult leadership? Do you have first hand knowledge that the FCF gives money to the leadership? And I respectfully disagree with the notion that TF could not be more paranoid than they are now. They have been in the past. Remember when the average member was constantly worried that someone was following them, always had a fleebag packed and never gave out their phone number or address to anyone? By contrast, most communes are currently much more lax about their security, and in some cases even advertise their home address and / or phone number on the internet!
Children in the cult were in the greatest danger when TF was more paranoid. This is the time period that saw most of the sexual and physical abuses. Anyone who has first hand knowledge of the current state of affairs in the cult knows that children are much safer now than they were then. Everybody in the group is guilty of being aware of abuse and not doing anything about it, but I think we should go after the ones who actually committed the crimes, not the ones who didn’t report them.
Everything you said applies to Zerby and Kelly and everybody else who has personally abused a child. The FCF is not, however, a “label”. It is a separate entity, with projects ranging from useless but harmless to helpful. Individuals like Victor Landivar should be removed from their positions (I have contacted the FCF about this), but since some FCF charity projects are a positive benefit to the community it would behoove us to be sure that FCF is in direct cahoots with TF’s leadership before acting against them. Assumptions should not be substituted for first-hand knowledge when we set out to ruin people’s lives.
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| | From Albatross
Friday, December 19, 2003, 10:47
(Agree/Disagree?)
Wolf,
Thank you for your intelligent reply. I should clarify that when I wrote of the labels they throw at us, I was refering to such things as Apostates, Vandari, bitter ex-members, and the like. I have some knowledge of FCF (if only secondhand) from my sister who prior to leaving TF spent a year or so there, and also from studying their posted financial data, and lists of where their donations are sent. (my parents are included on that list). I suppose that, whether FCF directly gives money to TF leadership or not, is (at least to me) somewhat irrelevant. It is a project that TF leadership have invested considerable time and effort into. I see it as a part of an overarching attempt to gain legitamacy for TF. Our views may differ on this, but I'm somewhat beyond trying to sort of parse out the blame and pick out only the areas (very few) where it may be argued that no "innocent TF members" would be adversly affected. While I respect the concept of an individual's right to freedom of religious practice, I place a much higher value on an individual's right to be free from the abuse, coercion, and harm that may result in the process of practicing that religion. That especially applies when the individual has not reached his or her majority. Since I fundamentally believe that TF is and has been abusive and harmful to a majority of its members, I feel less obligation to temper my desire to see those who govern it affected and brought to answer. If this means that an individual who gets funds passed through FCF may have to find other arangements, I don't have an intellectual or ethical objection to that. The fact is that the real missionaries managed prior to FCF, and I am sure would be able to manage should FCF cease to be. So while any effort to expose the FCF for what it is as a front for Tf, may well affect those who had little or no hand in our abuse, for those of us who are interested in seeing justice done, letting FCF slide by under whatever pretext, seems to be foolhardy. (reply to this comment) |
| | | | | | | | From Wolf
Friday, December 19, 2003, 12:53
(Agree/Disagree?)
Not all family homes are admitted as FCF projects, and some have been asked to give up their status as an FCF project because their activities don’t qualify under the FCF tax exempt purpose. FCF also has projects which are not run by Family members. Thus, FCF is not another name for the Family, though it was set up as a charitable front for the group. FCF has distanced themselves from Family leadership in the past years, perhaps because they both know this is the only way for FCF to survive.
If you tell me you have first hand knowledge that Family leadership current dictates FCF affairs, I will respect that. But it is my understanding that FCF management is allowed to run its own affairs.
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| | From anovagrrl
Friday, December 19, 2003, 15:07
(Agree/Disagree?)
If FCF wants to demonstrate itself as responsible entity that operates independent of Family leadership, it should clearly indicate which projects are run by Family members and which are run by people who have nothing to do with The Family.
IT IS NO SMALL, INCONSEQUENTIAL MATTER FOR AN ORGANIZATION WITH A HISTORY OF INSTITUTIONAL CHILD ABUSE TO HAVE UNIDENTIFIED MEMBERS SERVING STREET KIDS AND ORPHANS!!!! What evidence will FCF give the community that it has removed Landivar from its portfolio of funded projects? When FCF decides to fund Family members' projects, what safeguards prevent it from endorsing individuals with a history of child abuse?
Why doesn't FCF clearly publish the fact that it is funding Family members engaged in social welfare projects? As a potential donor and tax-payer, I am entitled to know the religious affiliation of these "faith based" social development workers. Those are the rules of the game for any organization that wants legitimacy in social welfare services.
Are you aware that FCF's liability for welfare fraud was exponentially increased by its own decision to withhold information about who is actually being funded? Once FCF chose to ride on the public welfare gravy train, it entered a whole new game of public accountability. FCF leadership bears full responsibility for the decision to be less than forthcoming to the public about its affiliation with The Family. If FCF cannot be transparent about the affiliation of the people managing its funded projects, it needs to voluntarily withdraw its participation in the Combined Federal Charities Campaign.
The Family has a long history of reframing the natural consequences of their choices as "persecution." Their behavior goes like this: I spit on you as an act of religious fervor, then you expose me to put an end to the offensive and possibly dangerous spitting, and lo-and-behold, I'm the victim because you're persecuting me! Don't you realize the rules that apply to mere mortals don't apply to God's elect? This rationalization for behavior and its consequences is sociopathic and cannot be tolerated by people who wish to live in a civilized society.
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| | From _
Friday, December 19, 2003, 20:48
(Agree/Disagree?)
May I add, peopel now are all "Victor Landivar this, Victor Landivar that," but he is most certainly not the only one at FCF. There are more faces being presented as do-gooders who to those of us growing up there were shepherds who terrorized us day and night. 3 or 4 of the faces bring back my personal childhood nightmares.(reply to this comment) |
| | | | | From Wolf
Friday, December 19, 2003, 17:58
(Agree/Disagree?)
I agree with most of your post. I’m not claiming that the FCF is on high moral or ethical ground. I am claiming that it’s a step in the right direction, and better than the alternative (cult members hiding out in cubby holes with their children). IMO the FCF has gotten more professional over the years. Their response to the information about Victor Landivar’s crimes will be a litmus test.
BTW they are pretty clear about their religous tendencies in their mission statement.(reply to this comment) |
| | From anovagrrl
Saturday, December 20, 2003, 09:46
(Agree/Disagree?)
The "faith-based" social welfare initiative is a fairly new experiment in church-state relations and social service provision in the United States. FCF has hitched its wagon to this initiative, and if it wants to play in the public social welfare game, FCF leadership better wake up to the accountability standards required of them--which includes public scruitiny of their affiliations.
Churches have long been a source of social reform and social welfare programs, so that is nothing new. What is new is the endorsement and funding of these entities by the federal government and U.S. taxpayers. As a professional social worker, I am cautious about the "faith-based" initiative. As the saying goes, the road to hell is paved with good intentions. Well-meaning people can create serious problems thought their ignorance about how to provide effective, evidence-based social services. Bottom line is, I don't want my tax dollars going to a clown ministry. This type of activity does not substantially advance the social welfare of a vulnerable population. It is, however, a way of preaching & teaching religious values & beliefs.
Those involved in the faith-based initiative have set forth some accountability standards, btw. Transparency is a major feature in these standards. (reply to this comment) |
| | From Peter
Sunday, December 21, 2003, 07:07
(Agree/Disagree?)
I would suggest that anyone concerned about possible FCF participation in federally funded faith based iniatives consider writing a letter to Marvin Olasky, the editor of "World Magazine" (http://www.worldmag.com/). Olasky was a key adviser and consultant during the early days of the OFBCI (White House Office of Faith-Based and Community Initiatives). Realistically, I can't imagine that FCF has any program that would qualify for any part of the potential $28 billion in HHS and HUD grants that may be available to faith-based and community initiatives. Nevertheless, I'm sure Marvin would be very interested to publicize the result of any grant applications ever submitted by FCF or one of their affiliates. Ironically, although his ideas have been used to support Bush Administration policy regarding public funding for faith-based iniatives, he has been very vocal in trying to warn religious organizations about the consequences of accepting the terms of such funding. Sometimes referred to as the "godfather of compassionate conservatism," I am fairly certain that Olasky would not find it very compassionate or fiscally conservative for the federal government to fund a non-profit organization affiliated with a "new religious movement" that has a track record of developing successful programs of child abuduction,abuse, and neglect. (reply to this comment) |
| | | | | | | | from chokehold
Thursday, December 18, 2003 - 17:43
(Agree/Disagree?)
I strongly suggest faxing in letters to Interpol so there is something concrete with a signature along with the emails that go in.
(reply to this comment)
| from chokehold
Thursday, December 18, 2003 - 16:19
(Agree/Disagree?)
It is crucially important to contact the agencies noted in this post as well and specify the 'Helping hands' project in Vladivostock as posing a serious risk due to 'Landivar's' past and accusations that have been made against him. Again the importance of first hand evidence is paramount as is the willingness to stand behind it.
Ian Huntley,
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/3312551.stm
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/3329595.stm
Who had a history of sexual assaults, sex with minors and rape, manoeuvred himself into the position of a school caretaker before murdering two little 10-year-old girls last year. He was sentenced yesterday. The authorities must shoulder some of the responsibility for what occurred as the information on him was there, but nobody put it together. This is a clear as example as one will ever find that if a person who is a threat to children is working with children, then the responsibility to have them investigated and the threat they pose fully determined is entirely with the people who know of his/her past. I am not proposing that Landivar is a potential killer, but he either is a child abuser or is a potential child abuser.
Anyone who is concerned about 'Victor Landivar' is responsible for ensuring that he is fully investigated and the potential threat he poses is known to all parties who may be able to exert influence on the relevant authorities to investigate. And this is important: demanding an investigation of Landivar in order to establish all of the facts.
In a case such as his, letters and communications must be signed and contact details given, the information pertaining to him should be clear and hearsay avoided, if you are writing without any first hand information documenting his involvement with an organisation that once promoted paedophilia and sexual relations with underage minors (Proven in the ruling of Lord Justice Ward) should be stated. Also who you are and how you are aware of this and why you are concerned.
Defence of children international
http://child-abuse.com/childhouse/childrens_rights/dci_what.html
dci-hq@pingnet.ch
Interpol
INTERPOL Crimes against childrenGeneral Secretariat200, quai Charles de Gaulle69006 LyonFrance
Fax: (33) 4 72 44 71 63Are good places to start.
(reply to this comment)
| From exister
Thursday, December 18, 2003, 17:28
(Agree/Disagree?)
I visited the child-abuse.com link you gave. While perusing the 10 little banners they give for their mission statement it occurred to me that the family has violated all 10 of them, some more egregiously than others. Here they are:
no child should have to work
child have the right to information
priority should be given to children in conflict with the law
all children have the right to go to school
all children have the right to health care
no children should be a victim of violence and war
--
children can express their own opinions
all children are equal
no child should be sexually abused Are there any of these the family has not violated? (reply to this comment) |
| | from chokehold
Wednesday, December 17, 2003 - 10:14
(Agree/Disagree?)
Has there been any response from the letters that were sent?
What police force is responsible for investigating Landivar?
(reply to this comment)
| From anovagrrl
Thursday, December 18, 2003, 16:28
(Agree/Disagree?)
I sent an email to children@interpol.int notifying them (the child protection division of Interpol) about Landivar's identification as a pedophile by survivors. This report may not land the guy immediately in jail, but it should pique some interest in this case as Vladivostok is known to have a sex trafficking problem and TF/COG already has a serious investigative file going on with Interpol.
If you have personal, first-hand knowledge about this predator, you may also want to send Interpol an email.(reply to this comment) |
| | | | | From exister
Wednesday, December 17, 2003, 10:42
(Agree/Disagree?)
No response here, but bureaucrats are typically slow.
The Landivir issue obviates the major obstacle here. Even if we could get a law enforcement agency to heed our letters they would still get bogged down in international jurisdictional complications. The only reliable course I see is to attack domestic fronts.
If Landivir is in Russia he is probably sitting pretty. Apparently the Russian authorities are too busy arresting and harassing politically ambitious entrepreneurs (Mikhail Khodorkovsky) to worry about a Peruvian pedophile. (reply to this comment) |
| | | | | From Nancy
Thursday, December 18, 2003, 16:41
(Agree/Disagree?)
They are listening and investigating. I just received a call at my office from Mr. Lambert. I directed him to the Lord Justice Ward decision. I also gave him Albatross' contact info. I am confident that they are addressing our correspondence. It just takes time, as the FCF is a pretty big topic to even begin to describe over the last few decades.
Also, a good idea is to give them concrete examples of our experiences in the FCF. Show them their publications and the court rulings, etc. They need evidence.
(reply to this comment) |
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | From Benz
Thursday, December 18, 2003, 19:26
(Agree/Disagree?)
I don’t know about you, but I am truly interested in acquiring a price list for the cost to “get justice” done to this guy. – I’ve heard a little bit of money goes a long long way in Russia.
- Seeing as the chances are this guy is in Russia for the very reason that he thinks he can avoid the law in western countries, I wonder how he fancies his chances with the possibility that individuals may decide to begin clandestine operations against him with resources worth far more than any of that which his so called charismatic con-artistry can muster.
Be warned fairly Francis Peruvian.
(reply to this comment) |
| | | | | | | | From Benz
Thursday, December 18, 2003, 23:18
(Agree/Disagree?)
I should clarify my comment by saying that since it is well known that money can make wheels of legal justice grind faster in a place like Russia, it may be an alternative to speed up the legal process if the authorities show no real interest and if it looks like the matter will become lost in a web of red tape.
I think any legal action would only be possible if there were written statements and formal affidavits from those who have been abused by this guy.
I am aware of some rumours and second hand information as I was in one of the locations mentioned where his abuses occurred but could not testify to being a direct witness in those cases. If any of those who directly witnessed or experienced his abuse were to write formal statements of this I’m sure action could start being taken.
My own assumption leads me to believe this individual will like the rat he is start running if/ when things start getting hot for him.
The fact that you thought I might be referring to other things that money could get done in a place like Russia is interesting, but of course I don’t think anyone on this site actually wants to do anything illegal.
(reply to this comment) |
| | From ChrisG
Saturday, December 20, 2003, 02:42
(Agree/Disagree?)
Out of interest, which location were you in with Victor? I was one of the little girls that slept with him and his wife in the same bed but I do not remember any actual sexual abuse, although I think it did happen. I do know two other little girls in our "combo" that he had sex with, but I do not know their legal names or where the hell they are now. One family-born person I lived with at the time I lived with Victor (Daniel of Sara) actually walked in on Victor having sex with a nine-year old, but he is still in the cult and would never speak out against anyone in the family. Now I realize the genius behind having everyone change their names in the TF, including us children. I only know everyone’s “family names”, and getting together legal evidence will be difficult due to this. I didn't even know Victor's legal name, until someone mentioned it on this site.(reply to this comment) |
| | | | | From Benz
Monday, December 22, 2003, 18:37
(Agree/Disagree?)
What we’d like to do and what we WANT to do are two different things.
I’d like to see this deviant child molester set up for a bit of pulp fiction style loving. I’d like to get a tape of it to send to any and all “Family Leadership”, FGA or SGA, and with a message of “you're next!!”.
But I don’t want to. Because I’m not going to be the one to pay in the case where I become a vigilante to pay back evil and harm caused, regardless of how much I’d like to.
If the victims were to write statements etc, I would hope we could all pool our resources to see something done to this guy legally, but effectively.
(reply to this comment) |
| | from anovagrrl
Thursday, December 11, 2003 - 12:44
(Agree/Disagree?)
How is sponsoring a charitable project (involving Russian children) run by a recogized pedophile a positive or responsible thing for FCF to be doing? Do you suppose that Grant Montgomery would respond positively to a letter from Victor Landivar's victims requesting that his project be removed from the FCF/Combined Federal Charities funding stream until allegations against Landivar are investigated? Are you suggesting that Combined Federal Charities regulatory authorities have no legitimate interest in hearing about FCF funding a project that puts Russian children at risk?
Exposing a pedophile in the FCF portfolio is not the same as attacking FCF, unless of course, FCF is really in the business of relocating and providing covers for TF's pedophilic missionaries. If that's the case, the Archdiocese of Boston might serve as a reminder that thousands of otherwise good and innocent people get hurt when corrupt institutions fail to reform.
(reply to this comment)
| | | | From exister
Thursday, December 11, 2003, 16:44
(Agree/Disagree?)
I don't pretend to be the best letter writer, but here is the email I just sent to all seven people listed as contact points on the CFC website. Even if you can only shoot off one line I urge you to do so.
Dear Sirs,
Thank you very much for your attention.
I am writing you this letter to bring to your attention a fact that is in my opinion an unfortunate misappropriation of charitable giving.
There is an organization listed as a recipient of funds from the CFC named the Family Care Foundation. Specifically, its entry in the 2003 Combined
Federal Campaign National List is:
9961 Family Care Foundation 619-468-3191 www.familycare.org EIN#33-0734917 7.0%
I feel an obligation to report to you some insights into the true nature of this organization. It serves as a legitimate charitable front for a dangerous and abusive cult that was founded in 1968. Originally known as the Children of God this cult has undergone various metamorphoses and name changes in order to evade the legal and financial consequences of their abuses.
There are hundreds, perhaps thousands of young adults who were raised and victimized in this organization and are now trying to recover and return to a semblance of functional normalcy. An informal sampling of what some of us have to say can be found at www.movingon.org. There are among us those who can identify known consenting members of The Children of God among the leadership of The Family Care Foundation. Furthermore some of us can identify as abusers individuals closely affiliated with The Family Care Foundation.
For these reasons I urge you to remove The Family Care Foundation from among the recipients of funds from the CFC. As a veteran of our military I am outraged that my tax dollars and in turn the earnings of my former brothers in arms may be getting funneled to this abusive organization that remorselessly serves as a haven for abusers of defenseless children.
If you have any questions or would like to investigate this matter further please feel free to contact me.
Sincerely, Andrew H. Stone, Boise, Idaho
If you want to send them a quick missive you need only copy the following lines into the To section of your email message
VDPITTMA@opm.gov, PARODGER@opm.gov, CASTEVEN@opm.gov, MECAPULE@opm.gov, MWLAMBER@opm.gov, mtpaterm@opm.gov, crrumbau@opm.gov
Let the flood of emails begin!(reply to this comment) |
| | From Nancy
Friday, December 12, 2003, 09:59
(Agree/Disagree?)
Just for form, as not to offend any ladies, you might want to address your letter to Dear Sir or Madam. Otherwise, this is a great letter.
Also, I think it is important to say who you are e.g. I am a college professor and a seven years veteran of the USAF, I am a licensed attorney in the state of California, I am a captain in the Philidelphia police force, etc. Then you have their attention. It would also help to add that you have personally experienced physical and/or sexual abuse as a child which was perpetrated by this religious organization. Say what age you were and a very light description of the abuse. Mention that there are several hundred other individuals who you are acquainted with who experienced similar experiences, some more severe. Mention that there is a court opinion that found, as a matter of law, that young people were brutalized and sexually abused by this cult and that the incidents were not isolated because, unlike any other religious cult, this one's doctrine promoted sexual contact with minors and instituted "schools" all over the world, name a few places, including the ones in which you lived, where children and teenagers where brutalized on an international level according to the doctrine of the organization itself, which published articles on exactly how young people were to be treated, including beatings, tying them to their beds, food depravation, isolation, sleep depravation, silent restriction, emotional and psychological abuse, including public humiliation, shaving their heads, beating them in public, including forcing older children and teenagers to remove their clothing and expose themselves, forcing them to wear signs, some very large on cardboard around their necks which read, among other phrases, "Don't talk to me. I'm foolish. I listen to the devil.", making them work in fields doing hard labor, not allowing them to wear gloves so that their hands became bloody and swelled, even young girls, making them wear certain clothing aimed to humiliate, not allowing young and older teenage girls to wear bras, the teachers of large groups of children and teenagers often molesting the very children and teenagers they were put in charge of, and if one resisted or tried to tell someone, they were punished, etc, etc, etc.
The list is endless. It is important that the public know. It is important to let them know that a couple books have been published about this abusive cult and that the things written in the books are all true and they are not even the whole story. Let them know there are a few lawyers out here who also endured this abuse and can be contacted for information.
When I spoke to an FBI special agent who works in a child pornography section, I told her all about the cult and its history and horror. I told her I was an attorney at the beginning and had information for her. Then after about a half hour of relating all I know, I then told her I have all this information because I was one of those children. I told her my knowledge is first hand, I was molested by a "teacher" at the "school" I lived at, I was beaten black and blue and have scars on my body to this day, I saw even worse happen to younger children...
We need to let these people know we are credible because we are established professionals now and because we are also the victims. They must know that our information and knowledge is first hand. Let them know the real names of the individuals who abused us and where we know them to live and what position we know them to hold. It needs to be very clear that this information we have is not hearsay, but personal first hand knowledge and that the individuals who committed these crimes against us are currently running this shame organization which is trying to appear legitimate.
(reply to this comment) |
| | | | | From exister
Thursday, December 11, 2003, 16:16
(Agree/Disagree?)
Here is the FCF listing from the CFC's own documents:
9961 Family Care Foundation 619-468-3191 www.familycare.org EIN#33-0734917 7.0%
This confirms that in fact the FCF is getting money from hard working
government employees. For those who may not know, the CFC is one of
the easiest gravy trains around. It is a listing of thousands of charities that sign up for a chunk of charitable payroll deductions from the military and GS workers. Many of these workers don't take the time to specify a charity and just give to the general pot, which is then split up among all charities on the list. The reason you should be agitated about this is that all of the wages from which these deductions come are federal wages, meaning they come from your tax dollars. As if it weren't bad enough that these creeps abused thousands of children they are now taking a bite out or YOUR tax dollars. You should be outraged.
Looking at the FCF website you can see the facade they have used to get on the federal dole. We all know that these charitable deeds are mere tokens and definitely not indicative of the Family's daily activities. They participate in enough "Feed the Poor" projects to make brochures, but that's about it.
I urge you all to write letters and emails to the people Nancy has listed urging them to kick these criminals off of the federal gravy train. Tell them you will start convincing people to stop giving to the CFC altogether if they don't give these predators the boot. Make sure you use the above listing number so they can see we are all talking about the same organization. This is a grass roots campaign people, and it's the kind of activism that works.
Yours in outrage, The activist with the active fist (reply to this comment) |
| | | | | From anovagrrl
Thursday, December 11, 2003, 17:23
(Agree/Disagree?)
To Whom It May Concern:
I am writing to inform you that the Family Care Foundation (EIN: 33-0734917) is a charity front for a religious organization called The Family/Children of God. This religious organization has a documented history of perpetrating physical and sexual abuse on the children of its membership. I have personal knowledge of this as a young adult who was born and grew up in The Family.
I also have personal knowledge that at least one of projects funded by FCF is managed by a man with a history of pedophilia. This Family missionary is currently known as Victor Landivar Trigoso, manager of The Helping Hands Foundation of Vladivostock, Russia.
Federal Combined Charities may want to consider any potential liability in continuing to endorse and fund a charity organization in which an alleged pedophile is providing outreach services to children. I am requesting that all funding to FCF be frozen until the appropriate federal and international authorities have had the opportunity to investigate these allegations against Mr. Trigoso and FCF.
(reply to this comment) |
| | | | | | | | From exister
Thursday, December 11, 2003, 16:59
(Agree/Disagree?)
Even one line with your name attached is worthwhile. The power of grass roots activism lies in the number of ordinary people willing to participate. We are all ordinary people with an extraordinary awareness of the evils of this organization. As such the moral onus is upon us to at least attach our names to the dissent.
Not to be trite but here goes,
All that's necessary for the forces of evil to win in the world is for enough good men to do nothing.
- Edmund Burke(reply to this comment) |
| | From Nancy
Thursday, December 11, 2003, 13:59
(Agree/Disagree?)
The website for the Combined Federal Campaign (CFC) is www.opm.gov/cfc/
Mara Patermaster, Director mtpaterm@opm.gov
Mark Lambert, Senior Compliance Officer MWLAMBER@opm.gov
Mary Capule, Compliance Specialist MECAPULE@opm.gov
Curtis Rumbaugh, CFC Operations Manager
Cherlynn Stevens, Operations Specialist
Their phone number is 202-606-2564. If you are a government employee, in law enforcement, in the military or an attorney, they might be interested in hearing your story of what the FCF/The COG/The Family really is, particularly the fact that it has been found as a matter of law in a court decision that The Family is responsible for both physical and sexual abuse of minors. If you are a governement employee or in the military, your money is going to The Family if you are giving to the CFC.
I have read that the CFC must accept all charities which meet their criteria. It would be interesting to see what their criteria is as I am pretty sure that a criminal organization which has abused children on an international scale would not meet it in some respect. (reply to this comment) |
| | | | | | | | from exister
Thursday, December 11, 2003 - 12:01
(Agree/Disagree?)
This is like telling an Army artillery unit that lobbing shells on a known enemy position is counterproductive.
In my mind we are in nothing short of an all out war. Attack all legitimate Family fronts and at the very least we will drive these savages back into hiding where they belong.
Give me a target and it's on!
(reply to this comment)
| From Wolf
Friday, December 12, 2003, 04:51
(Agree/Disagree?)
I can think of many instances in which “lobbing shells on a known enemy position” could be bad strategy – if it gives away your own position, prematurely alerts the enemy to a weak point in their defense, etc.
Bottom line: attack the cult, but make your attacks count. Don’t be like the Romans who caused Christianity to blossom by feeding some of them to the lions. I explained in my article above why targeting FCF is bad strategy. But I’ll say it again in a different way: At what point in TF’s history did the most weirdness, perversion and abuse take place? The period during which they were most closed off to the outside world! Destroy the FCF and you will drive TF underground. They will be more firmly under the control of Zerby and Kelly. Is that what you want??? Time to grow a brain already.
(reply to this comment) |
| | From exister
Friday, December 12, 2003, 12:27
(Agree/Disagree?)
Evidently you are some sort of strategic fucking genius?!? Or are you concealing your aversion to confrontation with a ruse of strategy? Don't want to piss of mummy and daddy?
These criminals need food and shelter. You give them too much credit by thinking they can truly go underground. Do you know how much money it costs to truly disappear?
Why don't you grow a brain, and a pair between your legs while your at it.
The history of human confrontation teaches us the tragic consequences of a half ass war. The only reason the Civil War lasted over 4 years is that it took Lincoln that long to find a general that was willing to burn and pillage until the South gave up.
If your intent and ideals are immature and you don't have the stomach for this fight then go crawl back into your hole. I for one would be less of a human being if I did not attack this present evil on all fronts. You live under the delusion that the Family is less evil now than it was 20 years ago. Whether or not that is true is inconsequential. They are at this time harboring sexual predators who must pay for their crimes. For this reason I am not interested in a "kinder gentler" Family. All I am interested in is no Family at all!(reply to this comment) |
| | From Nancy
Friday, December 12, 2003, 10:04
(Agree/Disagree?)
Yes, drive them underground. Reveal them for what they are so they can no longer attempt to appear legitimate and con more people out of their money in order to promote their illegal organization! Certainly don't stand idly by while they try to con our own government and rewrite history and deny their true identity and criminal activity.
Hell no!!! "We haven't even begun to fight [that insidious child abusing cult]!"
(reply to this comment) |
| | from JudasChrist
Monday, July 21, 2003 - 13:20
(Agree/Disagree?)
Absolute Garbage. My parents see and deal frequently (sad 2 say), with the FCF. Grant and crew DO NOT have Good intentions. They live 4 themselves (I'M ALL 4 THAT)!!!! Yet in the name of hard-working people supporting them?!? U R in delusion on the FCF's connections with the family. Hell, Sim,on Who is called Black FINALLy left when FCF came about...(Who ever thought that a member of the Family church, a pinnacle of the community would leave)? He FINALLY saw their greedy intentions. My father left for other reasons as not 2 be disclosed now....
(reply to this comment)
| from Nancy
Monday, July 21, 2003 - 13:09
(Agree/Disagree?)
This is a very simplistic analysis which comes to a flawed conclusion. Tax exempt status has nothing at all to do with regulating the activities of the organization. Obtaining tax exempt status is incredibly easy. There are Satanist and Wiccan churches with tax exempt status. There are also rascist organizations, similar to the KKK, which have tax exempt status. Having a 501(c)(3) does NOT regulate the activities of the organization. The Family has continued to engaged in abuse of children despite the status of the FCF. They will continue. Just because they have a 501(c)(3) does not mean that they are now pressured to become mainstream. They are not any more mainstream than before. It is not the same as becoming part of an established religion which oversees the activities of its churches. They Family is just as radical and abusive as they were prior to the forming of the FCF. That status has no bearing on changing any part of the doctrines or practices of the cult. It only allows them to legitimize their money.
(reply to this comment)
| from frmrjoyish
Sunday, July 20, 2003 - 23:24
(Agree/Disagree?)
I think the quote, "The apple does not fall far from the tree" fits here. The FCF is an apple from the rotten tree of TF, it may look and taste sweet on the outside but it's rotten inside. The public deserves to know the background of any charity they are supporting whether it be financial or in any other form.
The bottom line is that TF can change publicly as much as it wants, they can write 50 more politicaly correct "charters", or make up a dozen more "charities", they're masters at the chameleon game. We've all grown up knowing that there was one face presented to the world and the other reserved for the "insiders". We should know better than to believe that the FCF is just a bunch of people sincerely trying to make a difference.
The leadership of the family may have changed hands Berg's death, but Zerby's been there almost from the beggining leading and abusing right along side him! Nothing in that respect has changed at all, so they can try as much as they want to make it appear they've changed but the rotten apples are still in the barrel and still calling the shots!
(reply to this comment)
| From Wolf
Monday, July 21, 2003, 00:32
(Agree/Disagree?)
I agree that TF is essentially rotten at the core, and will be as long as Zerby, Kelly or anyone infected by them are in charge.
My concern, however, is for the people who are in TF because they think they are “doing the Lord’s will” and helping others. They need to see the light somehow, and they deserve to know everything that Zerby and Kelly are trying to hide from them. I admit that you have to be pretty strange to read all the stuff ZK & co are coming up with now and be OK with it, but I think it’s kind of like the frog who lets himself get slowly cooked to death without realizing it. Since I used to be one of those frogs I’m concerned for those who are still cooking away.
We know from the past that bringing TF into the public eye does them good. Zerby may still like to give little boys head, but after all those court cases she knows she doesn’t dare say it anymore. Family homes who are FCF projects are more “in the public eye” than others, which means those who live in them are more protected from abuse and more exposed to the real world. Some have even come to realize that doing legitimate charity work gets you much further than trying to pawn off poor quality goods office to office. My hope is that, as Family members come face to face with reality, they will realize they’re being duped, which will lead to the downfall of those duping them. Harsh outside attacks will have the opposite effect of pushing them further into isolation. They'll think “here we are helping people and we’re being attacked for it”.(reply to this comment) |
| | From exister
Thursday, December 18, 2003, 17:37
(Agree/Disagree?)
I was never one of those frogs. I never believed any of. I thought independantly from the day I began thinking. Postering was about money. Kitchen work was about eating. The whole mess was just a fucked up microcosm of power that I had the misfortune of being born into, and I got treated like dirt for simply being who I was.
I can accept all who have seen the light, but you will pardon me if I have no sympathy for those who are duped.(reply to this comment) |
| | From yup
Monday, July 21, 2003, 01:10
(Agree/Disagree?)
"We know from the past that bringing TF into the public eye does them good." So true.
The British Judge said:
"Peter Amsterdam: In the letter he wrote to me, he acknowledged:-
"We appreciate that a great deal of good has come from (all the investigations and litigation The Family has been involved in over the last 4 years.) They have resulted in many positive changes within The Family and have set us on an unchangeable course of more openness with non-members and society at large. ... Realising that not all of our young people will choose to be missionaries nor remain in The Family, we are attempting to make it easier for those who wish to leave to do so. ... Our history has been fraught with controversy; we have many times not foreseen some of the repercussions of our actions, and we realise that we have made mistakes. ...As times have changed, so have we ... We do not and will not revert to the practices that have been found unsatisfactory and abandoned. ... We realise that there are some children who were not as well cared for or as well educated as others, some who have had adverse experiences and are now complaining bitterly about it. Although we believe that much of what they say is untrue or highly exaggerated, [EDITOR'S NOTE: whatEVER???] we do acknowledge that there is an element of truth to many of their accusations. We are genuinely sorry for any negative experience that current or former Family members may have undergone, and we are determined to make sure that everything possible is done to prevent any such things occurring in the future." (reply to this comment) |
| | From More Jewels from The Judge on King Peter
Monday, July 21, 2003, 02:23
(Agree/Disagree?)
"The History for 1993 makes interesting but slightly disconcerting reading. ...My attention was drawn to Peter Amsterdam's summary of Summit-93 where, in listing the benefits from persecution he wrote:-
"But now that we're involved in so many Court cases, we've been forced to make an exception to our important lit classification rules that forbid our giving DO lit to outsiders. We have given some of our legal counsel nearly full sets of MO letters, so they can properly prepare our defence." (My emphasis) The implications of that statement are that some of the legal representatives do not get even nearly full sets of MO letters and all the representatives are denied some of the letters. Why, oh why? Because there is something to hide? Or because they lack the maturity to trust outsiders? "(reply to this comment) |
| | From i agree
Sunday, July 20, 2003, 23:35
(Agree/Disagree?)
Except that their Charter is not politically correct. I can never bear to read too much of it at once and I never am in the mood to read a bit more, and I suspect I am not alone. However, the Charter contains portions that undermine it entirely.
Did you know that one provision states that WS can simply revoke or suspend it? Beyond that, tons of provisions contain blatant loopholes.
What is the equivalent of a Moke written by Maria or Peter? A Marioke? No, that sounds like mariachis or karaoke. a Poke? a WSoke?(reply to this comment) |
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