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Reader's comments on this article Add a new comment on this article |  from Lovelight23
Friday, June 10, 2005 - 13:11
(Agree/Disagree?)
I'm so tired of the fighting and arguing about what should be done or what shouldn't be done or said against TF. We are failing as members of this world, in that I mean we are turning into exactly what we were told we would turn into if we forsook the teaching of TF. We were told that if we left the group we would be drug addicts, criminals, prostitutes, and god forbid abusers. We're loosing sight of many things that we once believed and reasons we left the group to begin with. Many people say, "I'm ok with TF, but that life isn't for me" as an excuse for getting out. Instead of recognizing that what they were teaching and doing was the real reason we got out. I can't speak for everyone, but I know in the cases that I've read about and my own families’ case, we left because we knew there was something very wrong with the group in a whole. We disagreed with beliefs, practices or just lost our faith because of those things plus the pain we'd seen in the kids that were leaving the group and that is why we left. If we really believe in a whole that what was going on in the group, either currently or years before, was wrong then it's our duty to the little ones still in the group and those that left the group to step up and do something about it. There are those of us that are really trying to do something, but it seems that at every turn there is someone out there that is trying to bat us down, break down our resolve and humiliate us out of doing the right thing.
If you were the one that was abuse, tell your story, get it out there and don't be afraid of criticism, from the group or your friends. It's important that we all realize that not only is it not ok for things to have gone on as they did, but to do something about it and make a difference.
I hate it when I read excerpts from people's emails and postings, SGA's, FGA's or current members, that us former members are just bitter or vengeful and that's the reason we are willing to "persecute" TF. God I hate that word, it's a word that only the guilty use. If someone feels persecuted for one reason or another it's most likely because they know they did something wrong but don't want to accept it or take responsibility for it. I doubt the kids that were abused and are now coming out feel very good about themselves when they hear that they are "persecutors" and they are just on a vendetta against them. It's not in their minds to "persecute" their abusers when they tell their story, society doesn't "persecute" groups or people because they haven't done anything that goes against the laws of the land or wrong in a moral and Christian way. They are trying to "PROSECUTE" offenders and get them out and away from society so they can't hurt or damage anyone else. TF doesn't want to get prosecuted for the crimes they have committed because like any criminal wants to get away with it or feels they can get away with it. Well, I'm here to say, it will not be tolerated any longer. We all have to hold people accountable for the crimes they have committed against us and not stop until they pay for their crimes and justice is brought to the land. That is the attitude we should all have, and if we employ that attitude NOW we will get results and we will prevail against our abusers. Because of our inability to come together as whole we have allowed these people to not only get away with the crimes that they have committed but almost OK'd their behavior by not acting sooner. Most of the men and women that abused us are going to get away with it because the statute of limitations has run out. How sad is that? Does that mean that it's ok to let people that hurt us and our children and our brothers and sisters go free and continue to live free lives when our lives have been so badly affected by their crimes? It seems to, we let it seem so in our inability or unwillingness to come forward before. And to you FGA's and SGA's that don't want to prosecute the group because you weren't abused or don't want to come forward because your afraid to hurt people you once knew and loved and want to remain friends, or whatever, get a grip. If someone was hurting you you would want someone to listen to you and do something. Getting out of TF isn't enough, saying that you’re not bitter or against TF is a cop-out! Your running scared and don't realize that in you insisting that your "ok with the Group, but it's not for you" has made it impossible for the ones that were hurt by members of the group to ever get closure, to ever see justice for the injustice they had to endure. In effect, by sitting idly by and ignoring the pain of your Brothers and Sisters in God, you have been accomplices as well. You weren't willing to come forward with information about the group and the people that directly hurt others, you are unwilling to be assertive in your own thoughts and minds and let them get away with it. I don't know which one is worse right now. If you witness a crime and fail to report it you are just as bad if not worse than people that commit crimes. You are in affect abusing the victims further by not standing by them and helping with all your might to see that they have justice and find peace of some sort or another.
I almost finished reading a posting I found from James Penn on xfamily.org and I'm disgusted by the things he said on there that was going on, it's so sad that so many people saw things that were wrong and stood by and did nothing. We failed our brothers and sisters; we failed our children by allowing this to happen to them and continuing to allow them to practice in this universe. It depresses me to think that they might have been people that could have stopped this from the get go. How anyone could be so easily led and fed this crap is beyond me, only the weak minded allow themselves to believe garbage like this and do nothing. Shame on you James Penn, for not helping the ones that are suffering for your unwillingness to get out there in the trenches and fight for them, telling them that they are wrong but not doing something about it isn’t doing the right thing. Shame on all of us for letting things get so far out of hand and letting these people influence us and our loved ones. I’m so reminded by this with the Michael Jackson case that is going on, he had so many people around him that saw things day in and day out and did nothing. They were afraid to lose their job or lose the money they were receiving to stay quiet that these children that he abused are the ones that suffer for it. Who is worse? Someone who commits the crimes? Or someone who knows it’s happening and does nothing about it? It’s a toss up for me. If I had first hand knowledge that someone was abusing my son or my daughter, oh boy, god help me but I would do more than just go to the police. If you are a parent, you know you would do everything in your power to help your children. Well guess what, SGA’s and FGA’s, wake up, we are failing our children, they may not be our children by blood, but we have to all feel responsible for them in some way or another. I know everyone has their own lives and they don’t want to disrupt it by bringing something this vile into it, but it’s a necessary evil. In order for things to be set right, some hard decision and actions must be made. If we’re going to “make a difference”, as TF is so apt at saying, we must stand up and do something. This is our chance to make our world a better place. It’s impossible to undo the bad and go back to the beginning, but was in our power to unite and let TF know that we will not falter, we will not be scared or feel bad to bring them to justice and demand that they take responsibility for the evils that they have committed. We must demand that they release all and any information about the members that were the abusers and demand that they make amends and take responsibility and culpability for every criminal act they have committed against our brothers and sisters and sons and daughters. The Catholic Church is just now starting to give into the demands of the victims of abuse by their Priests, why should TF be any different. They have equaled or put themselves above the Catholic Church in many way so why should be treated any different than any Religious organization that is guilty of such heinous crimes. I know, I know, innocent until proven guilty, but we all know they are guilty of everything if not more than we have heard or seen or been done to us.
I’m speaking her so forcibly cause I’m really sick of some of the attitudes of some of the postings I’ve read and the general inaction I have witnessed by my own parents to believe or accept responsibility for the abuse they themselves subjected us. One of the main reasons TF and it’s representatives are denying every instance of abuse is because if they acknowledge even one of them, they’d have to acknowledge that they themselves have been abusers in one way or another. I’m not just talking about sexual abuse here, I’m talking all forms of abuse. Some of the things that happened to us as kids is abuse, be it physical or sexual or mental. My brothers were severely punished on a regular basis for the most infinitesimal reasons. If they couldn’t find them doing something they would have considered wrong, they would make something up just to get a chance at spanking them. They were subjected to Victors programs and beaten as young teens. Made to do the most debasing things for no reason but viciousness and cruelty and these things were done by members, leaders and even our parents. My 2 sisters were sexually abused at the most early age of 8 and 7, repeatedly until they were 10 and 12 by men that were set up as caretakers for these girls in the combos in PR and homes in South America. I was sexually abused as well when I was 12, there was never full penetration because I was just too small for him, but he tried, he was kicked out at the time back in the late 80’s. But to my disgusted and dismay I was confronted by the fact that he had been let back in and forgiven for his sins when I was 20. God, he’d not been forgiven by me, that’s for sure! He had since married a member and she had a young 15 year old girl. How sad! One of my brothers had many problems with drugs and was in and out of rehab a few years back. I’ve been able to be there for him and help him as much as I could but it’s still not enough, his life is forever affected by the events that happened to him as a child. How sad! One of my other brothers was just recently released from jail in PR because he was just being a juvenile delinquent, thankfully he’s ok and hopefully he will be ok, but he’s going to be plagued by his past for the rest of his life as well. Some of these kids that are abused aren’t strong enough to make it out in the world, and one of the reasons for that is no preparation for the outside world, but mainly because they have broken souls and have been demoralized so badly by the events and actions or inactions of TF and it’s former members that they will never recover and live normal lives. I’m not really up on my bible lingo since it’s been a while, but didn’t it say somewhere in the New Testament about not letting one of His children perish? Well, many of our children have perished and many are still perishing because we don’t stand up and do anything about them. I’m guilty of doing nothing for so long as well, but no longer. I will be involved as much as I Can as my circumstance allow, but I will not stop helping Jim and the media with information and my support until I die. If you are not with us, you are against us. Who said that? Ha! Life demands that you take a stand, make a choice, who do you support, who do you believe, who do you want to win this fight. We all must do what we think is right, but if that means to leave one person out there in pain I don’t know how you could live with yourselves. I speak of my brothers and sisters as children cause I am the oldest of them all. I have 6 brothers and 2 sisters, all of which have been affected by their life in TF in one way or another. Every single one of us is out of TF and so is our Mom. Our dad continues to support his belief in TF and probably always will, he doesn’t deny that bad things happened to us, but is unwilling to do anything about it and has had that attitude from the time we all decided to leave. Very sad! He forsook his family for TF, he’s stopped being a father to us long ago and some of my brothers and sisters will never forgiven him for that, he’s not a bad man, just a misguided and blind man.
I realize how hard it is for most kids to talk bad about their parents, it’s been hard for me for a long time, but my family needs me to stand up and be by their side. One of my other brothers is currently in prison for a very bad bad thing he did. I won’t write about any details of what he’s done as it’s still all up in the air as to what can be done for him, but I will say this. His soul was broken, tossed out, and replaced by something that none of us have ever been able to live with. He’s been sick for a very long time but been too proud to get the help that he so very badly needed and because of that he’s in the situation he is in now. He was a very bright child, always inquisitive about how machines worked and wanted knowledge about anything and everything he could get his hands on from a very early age. He was very strong willed and even rebellious when he was a child, but to most of us that are parents, that’s nothing new, we all have at least one of those and we all know that beating them will only lead to more violence. He was taught by my father and those in the homes that violence was acceptable by repeatedly beating him and being extremely hard on him during a time when most children are in the formative years and needed encouragement and knowledge and love more than anything else. The only thing that comes to mind as I think of those years that I had to sit and watch the abuse that he had to endure is evil. They were evil and controlling and destructive to a child that had done nothing wrong but be just that, a child. And now he has to live with the man that they helped create, it’s not pretty and he’s not nice, he’s was mean and abusive to us as he became a man. As a teenager he got bigger and less controllable by our parents and the leaders and eventually they asked my dad to leave and find him some place to live. They kicked out one of their own creations and unleashed him on the world. How worse can evil get. He tried to make the best of it, he was very good with his studies, he tried to make friends and tried to have a normal life, but as it goes he was never able to live with his demons and lost it big time and is now in prison. He’s my heart break, he’s my heart ache every day. I was never able to protect him and now he’s lost to us for good. He was lost for a long time, but now it’s almost as if he’s beyond redeeming. Even if it’s possible that he gets out of prison, he’ll always be a reminder to me of my failure to be there for my brothers and sisters. I could go on and on about my family and the problems we’ve had to live up, as most families goes, I’m sure there are other people that are worse off. There is always someone that is worse off in any situation, but I’m ashamed to say that because of the things that have occurred, in and out of TF, we are as dysfunctional a family as it gets. I won’t place blame solely on the TF, because that would just be impossible to believe even for me, so I won’t even try to do that. Not all our experiences were bad either. I can say that I am proud of the person that I have become and I would like to think that I’m a better person for what we’ve had to endure and learn from, but there is always that small part in my mind that wonders if I would be a better person had none of this happened. Maybe not better, but certainly better off. I don’t regret the hard lessons that I’ve learned, I just wish I could have done something about my siblings before they were hurt. I think that’s the reason for my anger, I was unable to help them then, but I can now, and I’ll be damned if anyone can stop me. I will do whatever it is that it takes for me to help the ones that mean the most to me, and I would hope that if someone in your family was hurting you would do the same. So, in closing, wake up, stand up and do something. It’s going to make you feel better and make life a little more bearable if you do the right thing, I promise. All these things are hard to talk about but they are even harder to face, and that’s the real trial, but if we are able to do that, we can do anything! In order for us to move on, we MUST say no more, no more lies, no more covering up by any of us. And sad to say, by some people not getting out there and standing up, no matter how many posts you put out there with your stories and long winded explanations for not wanting to "persecute" TF, you are helping in the cover up. If you aren't with us, you are against us. I know that there are 2 factions here, ones that want criminal prosecution and others that want a civil case, that's great and all, but if we can't unite one way or another, we are going to get neither. Anyway, I've said what I had in my heart, hopefully you will all understand and take it to heart as well. If not, no hard feelings, disappointment for sure, but I don't completely understand how you could just ignore the plight of those you know are suffering, but I do know it's a hard pill to swallow, I've been there too.
Lou
(reply to this comment)
|  From true
Friday, June 10, 2005, 21:16
 (Agree/Disagree?)
ok i read the whole thing just because it looked so long and i thought i was a bad writer but like i said its the the family of loves falt but on the real i hate the family and hope they all suffer even my own brother and mom that are still in the family every on in it is evil......
but no one in the real world gives a fuck so lets just wish or if you have a gun you could kill some of them like ricky did im for both
true(reply to this comment) |
| | From xolox
Friday, June 10, 2005, 14:17
(Agree/Disagree?)
#1. Waaaaaaay to fucking long. For that alone I couldn't read the whole fucker. Not to mention eberything else that was wrong with the small portion I read.
#2. I'm not even a third through the first paragraph and I run into the term "we". Who the fuck is we? Speak for yourself.
#3. Your site handle is Lovelight? Really? For that alone, for the reminder of all that crap, Fuck you! A lot!(reply to this comment) |
| | | | | From Lovelight23
Friday, June 10, 2005, 14:59
(Agree/Disagree?)
#1 Nothing useful to say here. Have a problem reading? Then don't get on this site.
#2 We as in my family, as in the kids in the combos and most of the young people that I've spoken to. Is that really so hard to figure out?
#3 My legal name is Luz de Amor, therefore the english translated 'handle'. It would be nice to see people making sentences without having to use curse words, as it would seem by what you've said you need to broaden your vocabulary a bit. It's too easy to try and offend using childish words like that, and doesn't really make a point but says to someone that is reading your post that you don't really have anything good to say. (reply to this comment) |
| | From xolox
Saturday, June 11, 2005, 00:07
(Agree/Disagree?)
Well duh! Of course I have nothing good to say about your tornado of wordyness! You could fit the entire U.S. Consitution, and that of an aditional three small nations in that gargantuan, wearisomely verbose authorship of yours. And I can see you're still speaking for others, are they aware of your position as their new megaphone?
A good read is always welcome. (Please pay especially close attention to the second word of the previous sentence). I will continue to visit this site thank, you very much. You know why? Because luckily, (for this site's future mostly), your long windedness is not the only thing on the menu here.
I'm always looking to broaden my vocabulary, so thanks for that little gem of advice. Wherever did you find it? It sparkles... oh... soooo pretty. (reply to this comment) |
| | from roughneck
Thursday, June 09, 2005 - 23:20
(Agree/Disagree?)
Jules, this article needs some attention.
1) Strip the gobbledygook* out of reposter's comment below. Please pretty please. By the by, it would be really nice if there existed some sort of sanity check on super-long text strings, as really long URLs (et c.) really mess up the pagination. In short, it sucketh much ass to sidescroll web pages. :) Perhaps a solution (for URLs anyway) would be to have your post comment script replace URLs above a sane length with a clickable "this link is too long to display correctly" message (or icon). For text that doesn't start with "http://", perhaps add a space every 50 characters or so? WDYT? :)
2) Also (pretty) please decide once and for all if comments below those which get voted into the Trailer Park get placed in the Trailer Park as well. The reason I mention this is that at present, when a comment is voted into the TP that has comments below it, all the child comments seem to vanish into the 5th dimension or something. The TP page will typically say: "This comment is in the main site", but when you click on it it goes nowhere. In other words, you stay in the Trailer Park, like an unrepentant smarty-pants JoeH. :)
(*OK, so I realise it isn't technically gobbledygook per se, just that it just has no place being where it is, cluttering up the scenery. :) )
Thanks for your kind attention. :)
(reply to this comment)
| | | | from reposter
Friday, June 03, 2005 - 14:06
(Agree/Disagree?)
By BRUCE SCHREINER, Associated Press Writer 25 minutes ago
COVINGTON, Ky. - The Roman Catholic Diocese of Covington agreed Friday to set up a $120 million fund to compensate victims of child-molesting priests and other employees. It would be the nation's biggest settlement in the scandal that has staggered the church.
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The settlement, which is subject to approval by a Kentucky judge, would bring to a close a class-action lawsuit filed on behalf of more than 100 alleged victims. It accuses the diocese of a 50-year cover-up of sexual abuse by priests and others.
"After personally meeting with more than 70 victims, I am painfully aware that no amount of money can compensate for the harm these victims suffered as innocent children," Covington Bishop Roger Foys said in a statement. "Nevertheless, I pray that this settlement will bring some measure of peace and healing to victims and their loved ones."
Victims will be grouped into four categories based on the severity of abuse, and compensation will range from $5,000 to $450,000 per person, before attorney fees are deducted.
"The additional anxiety and stress that would have occurred to the victims had there been a trial has been eliminated," said Stan Chesley, the plaintiffs' chief attorney.
Last year, the Orange County, Calif., Diocese agreed to a settlement that participants said would pay $100 million to 87 victims. In 2003, the Boston Archdiocese, where the scandal first erupted, settled with 552 victims for $85 million.
Covington is far smaller than Boston, the nation's fourth-largest diocese with about 2.1 million parishioners. The Covington Diocese spans 14 counties and has 89,000 parishioners. The lawsuit also covers some Kentucky counties that were part of the Covington Diocese until 1988, when a new diocese in Lexington formed.
The diocese reported in August 2003 it has received 158 allegations of sexual misconduct against about 30 of 372 priests since 1950.
In a statement, the diocese and plaintiffs' attorneys said that $40 million of the settlement fund would come from a combination of church real estate and investments and $80 million would come from insurance.
Sue Archibald, head of the clergy-abuse victims advocacy group The Linkup, called the settlement fair and commended the diocese for its efforts.
"It's difficult to put a dollar figure on damages that can't be valued, but the size of the settlement signifies how serious the abuse and its effects were," Archibald said. "I hope the settlement enables the survivors to move forward with their healing."
Covington is the second Kentucky diocese to reach a multimillion dollar settlement with clergy abuse victims. The Archdiocese of Louisville settled lawsuits by 243 plaintiffs for a total of $25.7 million in 2003.
In addition to the dioceses that have reached major settlements, three — in Tucson, Ariz., Portland, Ore., and Spokane, Wash. — have filed bankruptcy claims because of abuse allegations.
The Covington case was granted class-action status in 2003 and had been scheduled for trial earlier this year but was repeatedly postponed while a mediator held settlement talks.
With the lawsuit pending, the Covington Diocese settled other claims, paying $4 million from its savings and $6.5 million from insurance over the last 18 months to resolve 56 sex abuse claims. It recently said it would move its offices to a medical center to cut costs, and earlier it announced some layoffs.
"I don't know that the money is ever a remedy for what was taken from us," said Kay Montgomery of Lexington, central Kentucky director of Survivors Network of those Abused by Priests. She settled separately with the Covington diocese and is not part of the new settlement.
"It doesn't bring back the lost innocence for the victims and it certainly will not bring the innocent life back to them," she said.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20050603/ap_on_re_us/church_abuse_settlement
(reply to this comment)
| from Lance
Friday, June 03, 2005 - 03:17
(Agree/Disagree?)
Hey weren't you the guy who did the really bad Kustav Klimt forgery?
(reply to this comment)
| | | | | | | From Lance
Sunday, June 05, 2005, 03:03
(Agree/Disagree?)
I wasn't trying to dis your art. I think a lot of it was great. I was a little puzzled about that one photo of "the kiss" by Gustav Klimpt, because it obviously wasn't Klimpt and you were standing right in front of it. I believe the caption read "me with new art ready for sale".
So while I'm sure it wasnt a forgery, I just thought you might want to explain the photo and that caption.(reply to this comment) |
| | | | | | | | From true
Sunday, June 05, 2005, 09:30
(Agree/Disagree?)
lance you are from aizona or this may be where you live now im from socal so im sure we will see things in the same way. not !!!!! but the one thing that we should see the same is that the family sucks... and what ricky did was right and i hope the people will not just go on with life and that the family gets away with this. the other thing that we should learn is that one person can do some thing to make people wake up and look at the truth........,....
true (reply to this comment) |
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