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from Jailbird Sunday, February 10, 2008 - 20:46 (Agree/Disagree?) I'm not a parent, but I do have nieces and nephews that I essentially raised as the result of my sister being mother being a single mother during that time. They're all in their upper teens and lower twenties and I blessed to have very good relationships with them. Perhaps the kids, my nieces and nephews, were just good natured, but I never encountered a situation where corpral punishment was needed. After reading everything I have and also suffering corpral punishment in childhood I've come to the conclusion that I don't think it's ever necessary for commit acts of violence against children. One of the things that wakes me up in a cold sweat and makes me loath myself when I think of it is administering swats to children when I was a child or young teenager myself in TF. I shudder when I think of it and really feel ashamed. It takes a lot of work to raise children, and generally there has got to be a lot of positive stuff going on, by that I mean one needs to be engaged in the parenting process by spending time with children. Activities have to be fun, frequent and consistent. If that's the case then there's plenty of leverage for discouraging bad behavior by imposing consequences such as suspension of certain privilleges etc. ... Punishment shouldn't take the form or work or a chore, otherwise the child will end up with the bogus association between work and punishment, same thing with academic work etc. ... All I can say is it's a lot of work and simply imposing corpral punishment seems like an extremely lazy method of controling a child's action(s). Plus when one teaches a child that physical violent force is a method of controlling behavior or adjudicating disputes, well, the child is bound to repeat that in later life I'd assume. (reply to this comment)

from Lance Saturday, February 09, 2008 - 23:55 (Agree/Disagree?) Wow, this is a good conversation. I say that it is a conversation because I would rather discuss this subject amongst friends then casually call it an argument. I remember many spankings that I received; I remember the embarrassment of having my pants pulled down, and having my naked body thrown over the knees of an adult. The beating wasn’t as cruel as the humiliation. Imagine your prepubescent balls being hung over the lap of some one that you thought you trusted. And then having them beat your sensitive parts with a paint stirrer. After the beating, they give you a hug and tell you that they love you. Such bullshit! Spanking is never justified. In my opinion spanking is adults saying that they lack the patients to explain how life works and instead choosing to beat it in to their children. It’s pathetic. Spanking is sexual abuse. It doesn’t matter who performs it. It is a violation of trust and innocents. (reply to this comment)

from SaraMarie Tuesday, December 03, 2002 - 17:05 (Agree/Disagree?) So far i havent had to spank my kid. But then again he's only 3 months old. I dont agree with spanking because i know how easy it is to abuse it. I've seen it done before, and also dont think i have the guts to. I dont recall being spanked as a kid much and never in front of anyone. i guess i was either lucky or just have a crap memory. either way a smack may be nesesary at times but what we think of as spaning is more like a beating and is definatly abuse. (reply to this comment)

from ChrisG Tuesday, July 30, 2002 - 13:41 (Agree/Disagree?) Because of all the spankings that I and my brothers and sisters went through, I also swore that I would never spank my child when I was pregnant with my little girl. This wasn't hard to stick to for the first year, but after she started coming up with some seriously dangerous and hurtful moves, I realized that nothing else would get through to her as well as a slap on the hand or bottom in these rare cases. I finally came to the conclusion that there is a hell of a difference between getting spanked black and blue by the "volunteer uncle" and giving your child a swat over her/his pants in a rare circumstance when nothing else gets through to him/her. My little girl is now 3, and it's very rare that we swat her, but at least she knows that it is a possibility, which is what makes the "1,2,3" so effective with her. (reply to this comment)

From charity Sunday, February 10, 2008, 20:00 (Agree/Disagree?) ATT: to all of you who spank or "gently" swat your children - this song is for you. Today my daddy spanked me and I know that I've been naughty. I disobeyed the things he said to do ooooo. He told me that he loved me and he really wasn't angry - he said his daddy even spanked him too. (chorus) And now I know my daddy loves me cause he showed me the way. He's teaching me to do the things I need to do each day. And even though my bottom hurts and it seems hard to understand. I know it's part of growing up - it's making me a man. Does the thought of your child singing this song make you absolutely sick?(reply to this comment)

From fragiletiger Saturday, February 09, 2008, 21:26 (Agree/Disagree?) When my son was 1 he developed, this obsession with climbing behind the TV. No matter what I did to stop him, or how I blocked off the TV cabinet he would find away to climb into the back, and play with the cords. One day absolutely at my end and, really scared that he was going to hurt himself, I swatted his little bum! I was immediately filled with self-loathing and memories of all the times I’d been spanked, and how they had never accomplished anything, but my son, after looking at me in wide eyed shock for all of 5 seconds, grinned and crawled off to play. Now that he's 3 I once threatened to smack him, and he turned looked at me and said very seriously, 'No, Mum we don't hit'. (reply to this comment)

From jezz Saturday, February 09, 2008, 20:06 (Agree/Disagree?) Chris G, I'm saying to you exactly what I said to Holen which is go and get some parenting skills! Time outs, positive reinforcements, lose of priviledges and plenty more are all ways to keep your chld in line. Most of all be CONSISTENT and FOLOW THROUGH. That's it. No spanking needed. Urgh - makes me so crazy to hear that you and others on this site - of all ppl - survivors of TF would have such a warped idea of how to raise your child. Don't breed if you can't deal with it.(reply to this comment)

From Fish Sunday, February 10, 2008, 20:53 (Agree/Disagree?) Amen! PTL! Do you?(reply to this comment)

From geo Sunday, February 10, 2008, 18:20 (Agree/Disagree?) "Don't breed if you can't deal with it." Nicely put. I would say I agree. I find it interesting that the people who defend spanking are the ones that spank their kids. The cognitive dissonance they exude seems obvious. First they dislike spanking, because of their negative experience on the receiving end of it. But then at some point, they have kids and end up spanking their kids, so now they must redefine spanking in order to portray themselves in a positive way. The assumption is that the people who spanked them were evil-mean-weirdo's, whereas, they are concerned-loving-parents. Their sense of self is too fragile to identity honestly with someone who is cruel (if you consider physical punishment cruel) so they must change their definition of cruelty. Of course, the people who where spanking them probably rationalized their actions in a very similar way. Our ability to rationalize will guarantee that spanking and other cruel behavior will continue unchanged in the future. Certainly, there will always be a good reason to beat your kids-if you need one. Most of the ramblings in defense of spanking (while I'm building straw-men) are versions of two core arguments: (1) I tried everything else or, (2) it works. The first argument would be defensible if data showed that all parents eventually have to spank their kids. Or, that the kids who were not spanked fail to develop properly. Empirical evidence shows otherwise. Many parents raise their children without resorting to physical punishment. Spanking has been found to be mostly a stylistic choice in parenting, with little difference in behavior and development between the spanked and unspanked. It is to the point, the choice to spank or not to spank tells us more about the psychological development and behavior of the parents then it does the children. In any case, while in the act of not spanking a child, we run little risk of psychologically or physically abusing them, the same can't be said for spanking. This is where I agree with the above poster, "Don't breed if you can't deal with it." Spanking as parental tool is at best laziness at worst a display of sadistic tendencies that are probably much more common in us then we would like to admit. The second argument (it works) is not even an argument, its hardly even an observation. Of course spanking works, you morons. Physical pain has always been shown to modify behavior. Like I told my girlfriend (during a similar argument), if she was tasered every-time she got a bad grade in college, I'm sure she would be motivated to improve. That fact that spanking works says nothing to justify it on ethical or even logical grounds. Punishments, as an operant condition, must still be defended versus negative or positive reinforcement. What is most insulting, in the dialogue of people who defend physical punishment, is the implication that physical pain is somehow more tolerable when the executioner is a solicitous and loving agent. They fail to consider the dissonance the infant experiences when the primary benefactor and object of affection in its life becomes its primary pain giver. But, we are surprised when grown ups choose abusive partners and relationships that mimic this love-pain paradigm. And this is where I go into my ramblings about government power-punishment and possible justification of physical punishment by parents if they are explicit in the fashion of the fascist--just don't pretend its for my own good, like the socialist--or something like that...(reply to this comment)

From jezz Saturday, February 09, 2008, 20:06 (Agree/Disagree?) Holon - sorry(reply to this comment)

From mad Monday, November 25, 2002, 20:07 (Agree/Disagree?) I think spanking is definitely border child abuse. I can understand patting a little child who needs a shock so they won't do something dangerous but past the age of 10 or even 5, you gotta stop taking out your frustrations on a child. Who will probably benefit more from loving induction instead. (reply to this comment)

From Joe Tuesday, July 30, 2002, 17:12 (Agree/Disagree?) well kudos to you, I think a lot of parents these days have no control over their kids, but someone has to be in charge, it's not a democracy for christ's sake!(reply to this comment)

from Crista Tuesday, September 11, 2001 - 14:39 (Agree/Disagree?) I agree with Holon as well. I have a one year old son who loves to put electrical cords in his mouth. I can't reason with him yet so I do spank him, but over his diaper and only with my hand. (reply to this comment)

from Holon Wednesday, September 05, 2001 - 11:41 (Agree/Disagree?) This is a very good question!Mary lou hemmer, has a book called I refuse to raise a spoild brat.(I think that's the name)She also believes that spanking children is a form of sexual abuse.You might be interseted in reading it.I didnt agree with alot of what was in the book however. This is the way I see it.Before I had kids I said I would NEVER NEVER spank them. My plan was to talk and reason with my children. Well I soon learned you cant reason with a 1 year old! LOL! We do spank our kids, but it is a very rare thing.Like when my oldest son used to climb on to the kitchen table and we would take him down and tell him NO YOUR GOING TO GET HURT!DONT CLIMB ON THE TABLE!And if he would continue to do it he would get a spanking. I would rather give him a spanking and hope he wouldnt do it again, rather than him falling and cracking his head open, or loosing a few teeth. We only spank on the bottom with an open hand, never with an object.and alway's over clothes.There is no need to humillate your child by pulling down there underpants. The age of the child is also another thing. My oldest is now 7 and he doesnt get spanked anymore.There isnt anypoint to spanking over the age of 6.(this is my opinion)It is just humilating and it really doesnt do much good. He would learn more from loosing the T.V. for the week or not being allowed to play on the playstation or the computer. However when he does somthing that he knows is just plaine stupid like drawing on the walls ect.. I will say " Why would you write on the walls? How old are you anyhow?"And say, if you do baby thing's your going to get reated like a baby and I will slap him on the hand. I never got spanked much when I was a kid. I only remember my Father spanking me 2 times.Once I locked him out of the house when I was about 5 or 6( didnt want to get ready to go singing)It takes alot to get my Father mad,Man, was he mad about that! And the other time he was told to spank me and my sister because all the kids in the area knew about these 2 boy's running away and we didnt tell anyone, so the sheppards intructed all the parents of all the kids who knew about it to spank there kids.He even said he didnt want to do it.( I was 11 I think)But other than a slap on the hand once in a while that was about it. My mother spanked us alot more.But I was a good kid so I dont remember getting spanked much by her after the age of 7. And I got a belting 1 time by the guy who used to molest me when I was a kid.Because I was sopose to be watching my little brother and he was found drinking laundery detergent.( I was only 7) That made me feel really really sick. Later that night he came in my room and said he was sorry he had to do it ect... and than began to tuch me.I just layed there crying.It was really really alwful.But that was the only time he ever spanked me. I think that spankings done the right way and are explained the right way is an exceptable way of punnishing a child from the age of 1 to 6. (reply to this comment)

From jezz Saturday, February 09, 2008, 19:50 (Agree/Disagree?) Simply put, spanking is the LAZY LAZY way of parenting. Maybe you should do a little more research on ways to get your one year old to listen - time outs, positive reinforcments etc. Consistency is the key! Your child will NOT grow up a spoiled brat if you are consistent and follow through. Are you? - many parents think that they're consistent but they're reallly not. If you do not need to spank your child - why would you? It's a pattern that needs to be broken. Don't forget that your child will always remember. You might think that it's all great now and that it's ok because you just hit your child lightly. I guarantee you that when your child is older, he/she will remember and it will effect him even if he and you for that matter don't realise it. (reply to this comment)

From charity Saturday, March 01, 2003, 08:21 (Agree/Disagree?) what???????? i dont agree with you one bit!! there are always other ways of disciplining a child...and yes even under the age of 6. it is so easy to underestimate the intelligence of a young child. why do you think you cant reason with a three yr old?? or one yr old for that matter?? if after reasoning with your child...you cant trust him to stay off the kitchen table...dont leave him in the kitchen on his own!! do you really think spanking will make a difference? how many times would you have to spank him before feeling at ease that he's in the kitchen on his own? once you start spanking your child...the more your gonna find yourself having to do it as that is the type of punishment your child will have learned to respond to. at the end of the day...it will only be a temporary solution anyway. obedience based on respect will have permanent results. geez have some respect for your children!! they are people too you know. you dont hit your husband or your friends when they make a mistake do you?? (or do you?) what your teaching your children is that it is ok to hurt someone that is smaller and less powerful than himself. as they get older they will reciprocate that behavior to their younger siblings...in school etc... geez does it piss me off when i see an adult spank a child for hitting. what kind of example is that?? i just dont understand why you dont think you can reason with children under the age of 6?? all you exSGA parents who find yourself spanking your children should really take a pill of wisdom and stop the cycle before its too late...otherwise your no better then your parents!! its all about good parenting from the beginning!! if you never spank your child from the beginning...you wont ever find yourself having to resort to that. its that simple!! (reply to this comment)

From maria Sunday, March 02, 2003, 01:50 (Agree/Disagree?) Yup Charity. And studies show how little effect spankings have on kids. Unless your gonna beat the crap out of them, it will only have a temporary effect. So then why spank or even give a "swat" when there are numerous other ways to go about disciplining your child.(reply to this comment)

From sara.w Saturday, March 01, 2003, 20:56 (Agree/Disagree?) Charity, sometimes a child needs a good spanking on the bum. There is a big difference from pulling down their pants and using objects to spank rather then a few swats with your hand over their clothes. I thank my mom and dad for the few spankings I had. God knows I was one spoiled brat who needed them.(reply to this comment)

From duh Saturday, March 01, 2003, 22:05 (Agree/Disagree?) Well spankings must not work if your parents spanked you and you were a spolied brat.(reply to this comment)

From porceleindoll Friday, September 07, 2001, 21:50 (Agree/Disagree?) I must agree with Holon on the topic of spankings and little kids. You can't reason with a child who isn't mature enough to reason. They do need to "feel" reason first and then they learn to listen, at least in the case of my kids it was so. They are 3,6,7, and rarely if ever need more than a swat on the bottom, but I can't remember the last time I actually spanked them. But what happened to you Angel and others like you, Sunny, my sister, and some that I know, it wasn't right and I wouldn't stand for it and I feel ashamed to have been a part of a group that allowed such public humiliation of children, and was severely strict at times. And for allowing perverts to have that sort of physical control over kids. I sometimes wonder why, with the gifts of prophecy they claim to have, some things were so overlooked by leadership. Though they do claim to not be abusive anymore, having abolished victor camps and such, taken measures to ensure the safety of their children, when it comes down to it, there are still parents I'm sure that are more than just strict to their children. I feel ashamed that I was an "under-shepherd" who watched some spankings happen and didn't voice my objections or concerns. I am thankful that I never saw any sexual or physical abuse to the extreme, but who can judge the emotional abuse that happened, and though the present state of the group is supposed to be improved, from what we have heard, who can erase the past from those that suffered when times encouraged overbearing treatment of children?(reply to this comment)

From rainy Tuesday, February 12, 2008, 01:11 (Agree/Disagree?) I agree. There are rare occasions in toddlerhood where you must win a battle of wills, or you must impress upon your child that this particular offence is extremely serious (running into the road or trying to climb off a balcony for example) where a smack is a good shock tactic to get your point across and convey how serious you are about it. But those times should be very rare. I have not smacked my son since his third birthday, and don't expect I ever will again as there are now other more logical consequences and ways of getting through to him. But I think the very occasional well-placed smack during the terrible twos was needed. I don't feel that I was abusive, and I don't think he felt that way either. The intention was not to hurt or punish for the sake of it, but to train. I think it's worse abuse to give all the control to your child, who then displays more and more antisocial behaviour in the hopes of being given some direction. The ideal is not to have to smack, but it's also important that your child knows you're the boss.(reply to this comment)

From geo Tuesday, February 12, 2008, 17:53 (Agree/Disagree?) "I don't feel that I was abusive, and I don't think he felt that way either. " No of course you're not abusive. If your psychological defense mechanisms are averagely functioning, there is no possible way you are going to consider yourself an abuser. Thats something other people do-not you. It is interesting, but the way you deal cognitively with the animus of your actions versus your self image (you dont feel abusive; i dont think he feels I was abusive) is probably identical to the way the abusers in the cult dealt with their own dissonance. This is why I believe that any dialogue with cult members about past abuse is largely unproductive; not because they are covering up or being dishonest, when they claim no real abuse took place, but because they are being absolutely honest. As are we, when we claim otherwise. They honestly dont believe they were abusive and they probably don't think we really believe it either. So, in their minds we must be exaggerating or making it all up. It is also difficult for us to believe that they can so easily deny and forget abusive episodes. Unfortunately, memory and cogitation are very flexible. It is survival, and not truth, that is their primary function. Honest self evaluation is not very healthy, especially if you have a lot of skeletons in your closet. This is why it is much more difficult for an FGA to defect then an SGA. This quote by Holon is very telling: I would rather give him a spanking and hope he wouldnt do it again, rather than him falling and cracking his head open, or loosing a few teeth. First, she's implying that it is his actions that force her hand (surely she is not responsible for striking him) but more than that, it is her implication that it is for his own safety that is especially detestable. Not because it is an obviously false dichotomy, but mainly, because of the assumption that the quality of a hypothetical danger somehow justifies her actions. Imagine if the danger was that the child would go to hell for eternity. How much harder is she then justified in spanking him? This is the kind of moral relativism and rationalizing that not only allows cults to abuse children but also allows governments to torture. All that is needed to justify cruel behavior is a good hypothetical (we tortured him because he might of killed 10 other people...100 people? Oh I mean thousands of people). Yes [torture/spanking/whatever] is wrong but...[insert hypothetical danger here]. What I find curious about the this type of rationalization, as it applies to this discussion, is that it is retroactive. Meaning that, the people who are defending spanking often start by explaining that they were initially against spanking (based on their negative experience being spanked as a child) but then end up spanking their own children so now they must retroactively vindicate themselves. This is not a clearly thought out, before-the-fact, ethical stand on spanking but a reactionary position. Well, congratulations, you are growing up to be just like your mommy and daddy and all those uncles and aunties that were "forced" to spank you--and you are learning to rationalize your actions just as well. And we wonder why abuse is hereditary and unrelenting. (reply to this comment)

From rainy Wednesday, February 13, 2008, 04:04 (Agree/Disagree?) Well you have very good points. I can't argue with them. All I can do is be the best parent I can, which I feel I am doing. By saying I don't feel I have been abusive, what I mean is that the few smacks I have given my son in his life would have been no more painful than his usual rough play with his friends. It was merely an assertion of authority. I definitely see a difference with the spanking style of the family, those spanks were designed to give real pain and to break a child's spirit. I did neither of those two things to my son, and I never will. But you have got me thinking about smacks, and I think even the symbolism (which is what my smacks basically amounted to) is something I don't want to put across. Because it's symbolising domination. I'd much rather foster independence in him. I agree, that my thinking smacking is a normal way to discipline toddlers is left over from my upbringing. But I have learned other ways to control children. After leaving the family I took childcare courses and looked after children professionally. I would never have dreamed of using smacks with them, because I was not their parent. For some reason the mindset that a parent must be prepared to smack their own child in certain situations stayed with me. But it's changing. I learn a lot from my son. He's a very honest and clear-thinking boy, and the communication between us is uninhibited. I certainly would never smack him now. It delights me to see the freedom he has to question everything. I think of the trouble I would have gotten into for saying the wonderful honest things he says and I just smile, I'm so happy for him.(reply to this comment)

From jezz Tuesday, February 12, 2008, 11:56 (Agree/Disagree?) I once read that "If you are forced to spank your child to change his/her behavior, then in essence, you are saying that you have been outsmarted by a child and are being forced to use physical force to gain your own way!" When it comes to something serious like running into the road, if my two year old does, there's no need for games, warning, or discussion - she's in the house immedietley. Outside play is over. She already knows that. If she has a melt down about it, there's no need to try and reason with her when she's in that state of mind. There is certainly no need to smack her!!! I put her in the time out chair, room, wherever and she stays there until she is calm and ready to talk. I find that most parents who hit aren't confident in disciplining a child and it shows in their actions and in their unsure voice. The child looses respect and the parents resort to hitting. Like I've said before, being consistent and following through are important factors. In response to rainy's comment " I think it's worse abuse to give all the control to your child, who then displays more and more antisocial behaviour in the hopes of being given some direction." You are absolutely right about a child needing direction and if the child has confident and creative parents, she wont need to be smacked to get it. (reply to this comment)

From mahnyack Thursday, January 22, 2004, 14:48 (Agree/Disagree?) i don't agree with that at all. reasoning with a young child, a toddler for example, shouldn't be the goal anyway. of course you can't reason with a toddler, but you can gain their respect. if they respect you, they'll obey you. reasoning with a 15 yr old is usually possible but if you're the parent, no matter how young or old they are its always possible, and the most important thing, to gain respect and consequently, obedience. if you hit a child, they most likely will learn to fear you. fear doesn't get the best results and they will probably just go ahead and do the opposite of what you told them, soon as you're not around. it's only human nature. (reply to this comment)

from EyesWideShut Tuesday, September 04, 2001 - 20:38 (Agree/Disagree?) I empathize with you, Angel. There's nothing wrong with you, you have to let the little girl in you know that you're going to take care of her now and she safe. You're just lucky you weren't one of the kids that got 75-100 swats with a metal hanger or vacuum cleaner cord on numerous occasions. (reply to this comment)

From ALIAS Monday, March 03, 2003, 04:47 (Agree/Disagree?) 75-100 swats with a metal hanger or vacuum cleaner cord on numerous occasions? Get serious.(reply to this comment)

From angel Tuesday, September 04, 2001, 23:43 (Agree/Disagree?) thanks. the worst was when they would threaten to spank us infront of the whole home, (there was about a hundred people)and i was 13,i was just starting to notice boys,very humiliating.(reply to this comment)

from Jules Monday, September 03, 2001 - 19:30 (Agree/Disagree?) Hi Angel, Here's my opinion on this topic. I think it is wrong to hit children, but I don't think that all "spankings" are sexual abuse. Some perverts definitely do get off on this though. Any type of sexual assualt or violation is not about sexual pleasure, it's about power over others. Humiliation, degradation and inflicting pain are ways to exert that power. The thing with spanking a child or teen is that you are teaching them that people in authority have the right to touch their bodies, forcefully if necessary. I am still sorting out a lot of these issues myself, but one thing I am learning is to respect my body and my feelings. If anything makes you feel "dirty" (like you want to take a long shower and scrub it off) then it is wrong. (reply to this comment)

From Molly Monday, October 28, 2002, 23:55 (Agree/Disagree?) I dunno, I was spanked fairly often as a kid - not bruised or anything, but spanked hard upon occasion, and I never felt sexually abused. Personally, I think that not spanking kids at all will most likely result in spoiled children. Yeah, the adults were strict, but it wasn't hell.(reply to this comment)

From Yes, it was Hell Tuesday, October 29, 2002, 00:03 (Agree/Disagree?) I don't know what corner of the COG you grew up in, but when I was young they beat us regularly, usually for some stupid, imaginary crime. The only way to avoid this was to be a brain-dead, passive kiss-ass. This is not "Strict", this is called physical abuse The Family didn't beat their children for being wrong, they beat them for being children. (reply to this comment)

From Sunday, March 02, 2003, 04:11 (Agree/Disagree?) AMEN(reply to this comment)

From angel Monday, September 03, 2001, 20:00 (Agree/Disagree?) i usually did, it was weird. but why would i feel like that but not other kids, whats wrong with me?(reply to this comment)

From Jules Monday, September 03, 2001, 21:09 (Agree/Disagree?) I don't know if things were the same for you in the Family, but not many of my friends talked about things like this very much at all. We all learned to "take correction with a smile", no matter what we were feeling inside. When I was a preteen and teenager, I felt like that after being spanked by a man. (reply to this comment)

From angel Monday, September 03, 2001, 21:45 (Agree/Disagree?) me too, i always wondered why, no we didnt discuss things like that either, although i was never one to 'take it with a smile' you usually always knew how i felt, ha. but it all makes sence why i felt so dirty and why i get filled with rage eveytime i think about it or when i see somone else hit their kids. i guess its more therapy for me.lol(reply to this comment)

From Louilee666 Tuesday, November 12, 2002, 11:38 (Agree/Disagree?) Hey Angel, spankings might not always be sexual abuse but it's still abuse and there are other ways to get a child to listen or to punish it without hurting it! Hurting a child does not help it to learn, it makes everything worse. I got so many beatings that I get violent myself when getting even lightly slapped on my ass even if it's a joke or something. I'm a slightly disturbed person because of it!(reply to this comment)

From Tara20 Sunday, January 09, 2005, 12:22 (Agree/Disagree?) Hey Louisa, are you Christal German's daughter who lived in India (Chembur) This is tara. I too have many traumas about the times we we given the "paddle" in the annex in Bombay every single fucking day. Remember they would hand out group demerits all day long andbefore we went to bed. Simon, Peter and Ivan...(some other I forget the names I was only 5 years old). Would paddle everyone on the bare bottom who had more than 3 demerits. Then during the child abuse inquisitions because of the bruised bottoms of children we ha to pt an extra pair of pants on while they walloped our asses. I really can't take about this without becoming very emotional. I remember during our arts and crafts class during school time uncle Ivan made a paddle and we helped him make it. That was our arts and crafts class. A paddle with holes so it would hurt more when he beat us is what he told us. I remember the long "waiting a a line" with our fingers on our lips in hallways. I remember when I was 5 asking uncle Jesse of aunty Penny when it would be family day again as I hadn't seen my parents who lived in the DF home for some months. Because I had talked to uncle Jesse in childlike anticipation of wanting to go home I got paddled 10 times because "how dare we talk and ask him something like that". I want to talk to all my old teachers and ask them if they have any idea what they did with us. I am mentally handicapped for life. This is the first time on this site and I get so mad and upset while reading as all these memories come flooding back. I have to admit what they brainwashed us into not believing. WE WERE CHILD ABUSED! How can I help myself. I can't forget the past (reply to this comment)